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Creation Science The origins of life and the earth from a creationist (Biblical) perspective.

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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-15-2012, 08:08 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jedediah View Post
We are not alike! Unless you lead others to receive Salvation through sanctification of the Spirit, by way of the BLOOD of JESUS, you are not saving anyone. Besides, the Holy Bible (KJV 1611) is clear that we are to have no fellowship with the unsaved.

II Corinthians 6:14-17
Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? and what communion hath light with darkness?
And what concord hath Christ with Belial? or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?
And what agreement hath the temple of God with idols? for ye are the temple of the living God; as God hath said, I will dwell in them, and walk in them; and I will be their God, and they shall be my people.
Wherefore come out from among them, and be ye separate, saith the Lord, and touch not the unclean thing; and I will receive you,


And what you consider to be narrow-mindedness and stubbornness is just a reflection of the distance you place between yourself and your Creator. The fact that you come to our Christian forum and deny the fruits of the Spirit makes that as clear as day. Your ways are foolishness with the LORD, and they are vain.

I Corinthians 3:18-20
Let no man deceive himself. If any man among you seemeth to be wise in this world, let him become a fool, that he may be wise.
For the wisdom of this world is foolishness with God. For it is written, He taketh the wise in their own craftiness.
And again, The Lord knoweth the thoughts of the wise, that they are vain.
I would just love to sit here and tell you why your wrong and listen while you tell me I'm wrong, but I realize all this discussion means absolutely nothing. I will keep believing what I believe and you will believe what you believe. There's nothing that's going to change that. You have faith in the bible and in God. Faith, by definition, is belief without proof. If you want to blindly believe something, what can I do to change that? As for you changing me, you won't have any more luck. I've been through all of this and more for hours and hours and hours. Contrary to what you may believe, I've read the bible, I think about religion and all sorts of reasons why it might be true or not. I spend many sleepless nights brooding over everything from the validity of the bible to the implications of religion in politics. Don't you think that I am just pulling all of this out of my ass. I have gone over this again and again in my head, slowly knotting together my own beliefs based on my understanding of what I know and have read, and nothing you do will ever change that. The only thing that will change my way of thinking is if you provide me with some sort of PHYSICAL evidence, that isn't the bible, of why the bible is true and god exists.
P.S. I was born and raised Christian. I went through all of the teaching and sermons, taking it all in, believing it was true. Don't think that I don't know about the bible and how Christianity works. I know as much as any other person does, if not more!
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-15-2012, 08:16 AM

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Originally Posted by Atheist at Heart View Post
I would just love to sit here and tell you why your wrong and listen while you tell me I'm wrong, but I realize all this discussion means absolutely nothing. I will keep believing what I believe and you will believe what you believe. There's nothing that's going to change that. You have faith in the bible and in God. Faith, by definition, is belief without proof. If you want to blindly believe something, what can I do to change that? As for you changing me, you won't have any more luck. I've been through all of this and more for hours and hours and hours. Contrary to what you may believe, I've read the bible, I think about religion and all sorts of reasons why it might be true or not. I spend many sleepless nights brooding over everything from the validity of the bible to the implications of religion in politics. Don't you think that I am just pulling all of this out of my ass. I have gone over this again and again in my head, slowly knotting together my own beliefs based on my understanding of what I know and have read, and nothing you do will ever change that. The only thing that will change my way of thinking is if you provide me with some sort of PHYSICAL evidence, that isn't the bible, of why the bible is true and god exists.
P.S. I was born and raised Christian. I went through all of the teaching and sermons, taking it all in, believing it was true. Don't think that I don't know about the bible and how Christianity works. I know as much as any other person does, if not more!
Wow, we have the world's greatest Biblical scholar in our midst !


Genesis 22:2 And he said, Take now thy son, thine only son Isaac, whom thou lovest, and get thee into the land of Moriah; and offer him there for a burnt offering upon one of the mountains which I will tell thee of.



I know God wouldn't let me believe in Him if He didn't exist.
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-15-2012, 08:21 AM

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Originally Posted by Jack O'fagan View Post
Wow, we have the world's greatest Biblical scholar in our midst !
Thank you! You just boosted my confidence level from 0 to 1.
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-15-2012, 02:24 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Atheist at Heart View Post
I will keep believing what I believe and you will believe what you believe. There's nothing that's going to change that.
So you choose damnation. So be it. I had hoped you were a latent Christian who just needed to hear the Word. After all, the LORD draws His elect to our Godly forum, like a beacon. It seems He brought you here for an entirely different reason, though. It seems that your only purpose in life is to serve as a warning to others, for it is apparent that He has preordained you to eternal torments in the fiery pits of hell.

I'm just glad that God has chosen me and my True Christian™ brothers and sisters to stand among His elect and join Him in Heaven, where we will praise Him eternally while you and the rest of the unsaved trash are cast into eternal hellfire, where there will be much wailing and gnashing of teeth.

The following verses apply to you:

II Thessalonians 2:11-12
An
d for this cause God shall send them strong delusion, that they should believe a lie:
That they all might be damned who believed not the truth, but had pleasure in unrighteousness.


While the next verse applies to me and the rest of my brothers and sisters in Christ!

II Thessalonians 2:13
But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth:


Sucks to be you!


II Thessalonians 1:7-9
And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power



The man who is being progressively sanctified will inescapably sanctify his home, school, politics, economics, science, and all things else by understanding and interpreting all things in terms of the Word of God and by bringing all things under the Dominion of Christ the King. -R.J. Rushdoony
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-15-2012, 03:06 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Atheist at Heart View Post
I would just love to sit here and tell you why your wrong and listen while you tell me I'm wrong, but I realize all this discussion means absolutely nothing. I will keep believing what I believe and you will believe what you believe. There's nothing that's going to change that. You have faith in the bible and in God. Faith, by definition, is belief without proof. If you want to blindly believe something, what can I do to change that? As for you changing me, you won't have any more luck. I've been through all of this and more for hours and hours and hours. Contrary to what you may believe, I've read the bible, I think about religion and all sorts of reasons why it might be true or not. I spend many sleepless nights brooding over everything from the validity of the bible to the implications of religion in politics. Don't you think that I am just pulling all of this out of my ass. I have gone over this again and again in my head, slowly knotting together my own beliefs based on my understanding of what I know and have read, and nothing you do will ever change that. The only thing that will change my way of thinking is if you provide me with some sort of PHYSICAL evidence, that isn't the bible, of why the bible is true and god exists.
P.S. I was born and raised Christian. I went through all of the teaching and sermons, taking it all in, believing it was true. Don't think that I don't know about the bible and how Christianity works. I know as much as any other person does, if not more!
Perhaps there's a lesson here for you on the worth of trying to browbeat people from a faith position by yelling, "You're wrong! Your God is fake. Oh, look! Science!"

So why did you come here again?



Isaiah 34:6 The sword of the LORD is filled with blood, it is made fat with fatness, and with the blood of lambs and goats, with the fat of the kidneys of rams: for the LORD hath a sacrifice in Bozrah, and a great slaughter in the land of Idumea.

John 5:46,47 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me. But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

Join me in scoffing at backwards Muslims clinging to their beliefs in the face of the evidence!
The truth about volcanos
Sex and debauchery in public schools
Faith wins over science (explained for even the very stupid)
God Cures AIDS - GLORY!
Desert whale bones prove Great Flood once and for all.
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-15-2012, 03:39 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Atheist at Heart View Post
I would just love to sit here and tell you why your wrong and listen while you tell me I'm wrong, but I realize all this discussion means absolutely nothing. I will keep believing what I believe and you will believe what you believe. There's nothing that's going to change that. You have faith in the bible and in God. Faith, by definition, is belief without proof.
Friend,

As the Bible says, look the plank in your eye before complaining about the mote in the eye of another. We have all the proof in the world of God's existence, all of it extra Biblical, please see my signature. But this is besides the point here; were is the proof for non-existence of God? We've been asking weeks now and no Atheists has been able to furnish it.



Time to reclaim our FREEDOM from the “Mullah in Chief” and his growing activist voter hoards of socialists, communists, anti-Semites, anti-Christians, atheists, radical gays and lesbians, feminists, illegal immigrants, Muslims, anti-Anglo whites and others.

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Time to come clean on Benghazi Mr Obama!
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-19-2012, 06:56 PM

There was a planecrash with 147 dead people. Only one child survived. So God is REAL!
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-27-2012, 08:01 PM

The video just states everything in the bible is right and written by god (no question about it or gods existence) and therefore everything scientific based on REAL evidence is nonsense. Therefore the whole video in the start is totally nonsense
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-27-2012, 10:25 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandthee View Post
The video just states everything in the bible is right and written by god (no question about it or gods existence) and therefore everything scientific based on REAL evidence is nonsense. Therefore the whole video in the start is totally nonsense
You are overlooking the fact that everything scientific which contradicts God's Inerrant Word is based on FALSE evidence.
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-27-2012, 10:30 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by MitzaLizalor View Post
You are overlooking the fact that everything scientific which contradicts God's Inerrant Word is based on FALSE evidence.
What are you herping about, are you educated at all? Science contradicting what the bible says is false in YOUR EYES because you're ignorant as hell
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-27-2012, 10:40 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandthee View Post
What are you herping about,
My Sister in Christ Mitza does not have Herpes, and I will thank you to cease casting aspersions upon her character.

This is a Christian church's discussion forum, not 4chan. If you want to talk about Jesus, welcome. If you want to talk about sex diseases and ladyparts, this is not the place for you.


Bible boring? Nonsense!
Try Bible in a Year with Brother V, or join Shirlee and the kids as they discuss Real Bible Stories!
You can't be a Christian if you don't know God's Word!
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-28-2012, 12:55 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandthee View Post
What are you herping about, are you educated at all? Science contradicting what the bible says is false in YOUR EYES because you're ignorant as hell
We know that there is science which does not contradict The Bible. God explains:
DANIEL 1
3
¶ And the king spake vnto Ashpenaz the master of his Eunuches, that he should bring certaine of the children of Israel, and of the kings seed, and of the Princes:
4 Children in whom was no blemish, but well fauoured, and skilfull in all wisedome, and cunning in knowledge, and
vnderstanding science, and such as had abilitie in them to stand in the Kings palace, and whom they might teach the learning, and the tongue of the Caldeans.
5 And the King appointed them a daily prouision of the kings meat, and of the wine which he dranke: so nourishing them three yeeres, that at the ende thereof they might stand before the king.
6 Now among these were of the children of Iudah, Daniel, Hananiah, Mishael, and Azariah:
©1611
If you continue reading the historical narrative of Daniel you will see that he was indeed a man of God. And he understood science.

Babylon was a multicultural society. They fancied that they could collect "cultures" and even "societies" including the Israelites who had elected to follow satan and experiment with false belief systems (including false science) resulting in their being led away into captivity by God:
Daniel 1:2 And the Lord gaue Iehoiakim king of Iudah into his hand, with part of the vessels of the house of God, which he caried into the land of Shinar to the house of his god, and he brought the vessels into the treasure house of his god.
©1611
OK, mad king Nebuchad-nezzar probably thought that he was doing it,
Daniel 1:1 In the thirde yere of the reigne of Iehoiakim King of Iudah, came Nebuchad-nezzar King of Babylon, vnto Ierusalem, and besieged it.
©1611
..but he wasn't. It was part of God's plan to bring insights based on FACT into scrofulous Babylon and throughout history (the relevant portions of which are preserved for us by God in The Bible) we see such opportunities given to nations, cities and individuals who are able to benefit from hearing The Truth and the glorious bounty that follows on from their acceptance of that message. Praise God!

We also see the catastrophe that follows rejection of His Perfest Love (being deported to the cesspool of ancient Babylon is quite a good example of that, isn't it?) but when individuals choose to reject satan and follow God's Inerrant Truth we are assured of certain triumph even in the face of certain death.

Here is all of Daniel in a sans serif font which might be a bit easier for you to understand; if you read it you will see what I mean.

To fill one's nation with any culture other than the one culture which follows God's Word, true science and the redemptive power of Christ's Blood is to fill one's nation with scum - as God has pointed out to us time and time again. Through history. Through the contamination of sin which blights so many nations today and through repeated direct intervention by God by which means many continue to be blasted even in the "modern" era..

When you actually listen to what He says and follow His word, as Daniel - a man of science - listened, you realise how dire the outcome of ignorance really is. Eventually, Nebuchad-nezzar accepted that and you can accept it too. Contact the Pastors at an early opportunity for sound doctrine and accurate teaching. Especially concerning science.
DANIEL 4
34
And at the end of the dayes I Nebuchad-nezzar lift vp mine eyes vnto heauen, and mine vnderstanding returned vnto me, and I blessed the most high, and I praised, and honoured him that liueth for euer, whose dominion is an euerlasting dominion, and his kingdome is from generation to generation.
35 And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and hee doth according to his will in the armie of heauen, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say vnto him, What doest thou?
36 At the same time my reason returned vnto me, and for the glory of my kingdome, mine honour, and brightnes returned vnto me, and my counsellers, and my Lords sought vnto me, and I was established in my kingdome, and excellent Maiestie was added vnto me.
37 Now I Nebuchad-nezzar praise, and extoll and honour the King of heauen, all whose workes are truth, and his waies iudgement, and those that walke in pride he is able to abase.
©1611
what days? see DANIEL 4:33
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-28-2012, 09:49 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rev. M. Rodimer View Post
My Sister in Christ Mitza does not have Herpes, and I will thank you to cease casting aspersions upon her character.

This is a Christian church's discussion forum, not 4chan. If you want to talk about Jesus, welcome. If you want to talk about sex diseases and ladyparts, this is not the place for you.
I was not talking about any decease, maybe if you google if you will find the meaning of "herping".

Anyways, I think it's impossible with people on here to discuss properly anyways, because you people don't think of any argument yourself, you just say: God says, the bible says etc...
Maybe you have to start thinking more yourself instead of what other people 2000years ago thought.
And I'm not from 4chan or anything like that, I just got fed up with some reactions people give me here, they are directly offending me for being atheist.
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-28-2012, 05:33 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandthee View Post
I was not talking about any decease, maybe if you google if you will find the meaning of "herping".

Anyways, I think it's impossible with people on here to discuss properly anyways, because you people don't think of any argument yourself, you just say: God says, the bible says etc...
Maybe you have to start thinking more yourself instead of what other people 2000years ago thought.
And I'm not from 4chan or anything like that, I just got fed up with some reactions people give me here, they are directly offending me for being atheist.
Well, did you ever think that you are offending us for being an atheist? You sit there and mock our religion and dare to suggest we don't think but blindly obey. You come to our friendly forum and argue with us about things you know nothing about.

For your information, there are enormous records of historical and scientific value that confirm things in the Holy Bible. When God says something, He means it. This has been proven over and over again.


Hello, my name is Mary. I hope to fellowship with you! That is, unless you don't listen to church authority (Deuteronomy 17:12); are a witch (Exodus 22:17); are a homosexual (Leviticus 20:13; Romans 1:24-32); or fortuneteller (Leviticus 20:27) or a snotty kid who hits their dad (Exodus 21:15); or curses their parents (Proverbs 20:20; Leviticus 20:9); an adulterer (Leviticus 20:10); a non-Christian (Exodus 22:19; Deuteronomy 13:7-12; Deuteronomy 17:2-5;Romans 1:24-32); an atheist (2 Chronicles 15:12-13); or false prophet (Zechariah 13:3); from the town of one who worships another, false god (Deuteronomy 13:13-19); were a non-virgin bride (Deuteronomy 22:20-21); or blasphemer (Leviticus 24:10-16), as God calls for your execution and will no doubt send you to Hell, and I have no interest developing a friendship with the Spiritually Walking Dead.

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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-28-2012, 05:52 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mary Etheldreda View Post
Well, did you ever think that you are offending us for being an atheist? You sit there and mock our religion and dare to suggest we don't think but blindly obey. You come to our friendly forum and argue with us about things you know nothing about.

For your information, there are enormous records of historical and scientific value that confirm things in the Holy Bible. When God says something, He means it. This has been proven over and over again.
First of all. This forum is not friendly. You people start offending people here on the forum all the time, calling them names etc. So that's a lie. Second you offend me for being so ignorant, so we're even there.
Then furthermore you people DO BLINDLY OBEY the bible, that's what the whole baptist church is about, you obey and follow every single word of the bible.

And there are not any scientific proofs of god, people like you just SAY god exists and call it science.

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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-28-2012, 06:06 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandthee View Post
First of all. This forum is not friendly. You people start offending people here on the forum all the time, calling them names etc. So that's a lie.
People respond according to the respect they're given. People come on here all the time and are greeted with warm welcomes.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandthee View Post
Second you offend me for being so ignorant, so we're even there.
We're not even because I didn't come into your home uninvited and start spewing all kinds of hate at you and your family.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandthee View Post
Then furthermore you people DO BLINDLY OBEY the bible, that's what the whole baptist church is about, you obey and follow every single word of the bible.
Yes, but not for no reason. Faith is a gift from God, it is how we know to obey the Holy Bible and not the Koran.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandthee View Post
And there are not any scientific proofs of god, people like you just SAY god exists and call it science.
There are proofs all over this forum, for starters! If you use the handy "search" function, you'll see evidence for all kinds of subjects that have been studied in depth!

Evolution
Math
History
Optical Physics
Astrology
The Origins of the World


Hello, my name is Mary. I hope to fellowship with you! That is, unless you don't listen to church authority (Deuteronomy 17:12); are a witch (Exodus 22:17); are a homosexual (Leviticus 20:13; Romans 1:24-32); or fortuneteller (Leviticus 20:27) or a snotty kid who hits their dad (Exodus 21:15); or curses their parents (Proverbs 20:20; Leviticus 20:9); an adulterer (Leviticus 20:10); a non-Christian (Exodus 22:19; Deuteronomy 13:7-12; Deuteronomy 17:2-5;Romans 1:24-32); an atheist (2 Chronicles 15:12-13); or false prophet (Zechariah 13:3); from the town of one who worships another, false god (Deuteronomy 13:13-19); were a non-virgin bride (Deuteronomy 22:20-21); or blasphemer (Leviticus 24:10-16), as God calls for your execution and will no doubt send you to Hell, and I have no interest developing a friendship with the Spiritually Walking Dead.

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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-28-2012, 06:08 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandthee View Post
First of all. This forum is not friendly. You people start offending people here on the forum all the time, calling them names etc. So that's a lie. Second you offend me for being so ignorant, so we're even there.
Then furthermore you people DO BLINDLY OBEY the bible, that's what the whole baptist church is about, you obey and follow every single word of the bible.

And there are not any scientific proofs of god, people like you just SAY god exists and call it science.
Why are you here? Just to persecute us? Yes, we believe EVERY SINGLE WORD of the KJV1611. Therefore, we reject the secular world and their so-called "science"becuase it contradicts the Word of God.

Believing the Bible is about FAITH, not "science". The Bible is true because it is God's Word. How do we know this? It says so in the Bible. If you, an ignorant atheist, want proof of God, go jump off a bridge. When you die, God will send you to Hell. Will that be proof enough for you?

Faith is about believing that which is unverifiable. God set things up this way so that He wouldn't have to deal with a bunch of Doubting Thomas' up in Heaven. Hell is where all those who lack faith, or have the wrong faith, will spend eternity. Does that help?




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Zandthee Zandthee is offline
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-28-2012, 06:10 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mary Etheldreda View Post
People respond according to the respect they're given. People come on here all the time and are greeted with warm welcomes.



We're not even because I didn't come into your home uninvited and start spewing all kinds of hate at you and your family.



Yes, but not for no reason. Faith is a gift from God, it is how we know to obey the Holy Bible and not the Koran.



There are proofs all over this forum, for starters! If you use the handy "search" function, you'll see evidence for all kinds of subjects that have been studied in depth!

Evolution
Math
History
Optical Physics
Astrology
The Origins of the World
-I've seen people who reply very neat and gently and get spit on by members of your church, so you're lying again.

-You say I go to hell just because I'm not a part of your faith, so you're spewing out hatred on me if you want or not.

-Faith exists because people don't know how to explain things and turn to a god, it's called ignorance.

-In depth? Like the theory about T-rex being a giant kangaroo and the world being flat with a photo made by a travel organisation? Are you kidding me?
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-28-2012, 06:17 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandthee View Post
-I've seen people who reply very neat and gently and get spit on by members of your church, so you're lying again.
Passive aggressive behavior doesn't fool anyone. If someone is responded to harshly, it is because they invite that kind of dialog in the first place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandthee View Post
-You say I go to hell just because I'm not a part of your faith, so you're spewing out hatred on me if you want or not.
Friend, we just pass along the Good News of the Bible. You can feel offended all you want. OR...you can confess your sins and acknowledge Christ as your LORD and Master and avoid Hell altogether. (Romans 10:9)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandthee View Post
-Faith exists because people don't know how to explain things and turn to a god, it's called ignorance.
Faith and grace are a gift from God. (Ephesians 2:8)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zandthee View Post
-In depth? Like the theory about T-rex being a giant kangaroo and the world being flat with a photo made by a travel organisation? Are you kidding me?
Have you actually read the threads or skimmed through? If you skim, you'll likely focus on the argumentative bickering. I suggest you read them, look at the information presented, prayerfully consider what God is trying to show you. Open your heart to the truth.



Hello, my name is Mary. I hope to fellowship with you! That is, unless you don't listen to church authority (Deuteronomy 17:12); are a witch (Exodus 22:17); are a homosexual (Leviticus 20:13; Romans 1:24-32); or fortuneteller (Leviticus 20:27) or a snotty kid who hits their dad (Exodus 21:15); or curses their parents (Proverbs 20:20; Leviticus 20:9); an adulterer (Leviticus 20:10); a non-Christian (Exodus 22:19; Deuteronomy 13:7-12; Deuteronomy 17:2-5;Romans 1:24-32); an atheist (2 Chronicles 15:12-13); or false prophet (Zechariah 13:3); from the town of one who worships another, false god (Deuteronomy 13:13-19); were a non-virgin bride (Deuteronomy 22:20-21); or blasphemer (Leviticus 24:10-16), as God calls for your execution and will no doubt send you to Hell, and I have no interest developing a friendship with the Spiritually Walking Dead.

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Zandthee Zandthee is offline
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Default Re: PROOF God is REAL! - 05-28-2012, 06:33 PM

There is no god showing me anything, only thing I see is a book with a story and a lot of people trying to convince others to believe their story! You think you're the real Christian, going to heaven and everyone else will go to hell, other Christians (which you don't call Christians oddly enough) who believe in another version of the bible or don't take the bible seriously word for word would be wrong and people with other religions? There are like hundreds of religions but still every single person believing in a religion is 100% sure, their religion is real and their god is real. The most logic solution to this is that you are ALL wrong.
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