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Default Mathematics and God? Musings from a junkie. - 03-07-2014, 11:58 AM

I would just like to say that I am not starting this thread to upset anyone. If you want to argue against this, you are free to do so. I have been mistaken as "Unsaved trash of prefers math over Jesus." I have never claimed that mathematics is above the Lord. Here is my claim (and I would like opinions):

Mathematics is extremely elegant and is the "code" of the universe. We are all bound by it. When God created the universe, wouldn't he have had the desire for it to be as beautiful and elegant as possible? Maybe God wrote the universe in the language of mathematics.

Here's the thing: Mathematics is separate from all other sciences. Just because you are extremely knowledgable in this field does not mean you are bound to believe any other scientific theories. The greatest mathematicians have said that the more they unravel in math, the stronger their faith becomes because of how elegant it is.
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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 12:06 PM

Welcome, friend. First we'd like to know where you're at spiritually. Do you believe in God? Do you go to church? Have you read the Bible? Please introduce yourself to us properly.

Your opinions about math have no basis in Scripture; therefore I give them no credence. God created the universe through the power of His Word. He spoke, and things popped into existence (Genesis 1). He has revealed Himself to us through the Bible, not through math.

Rom 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.


Mt 21:42, 44 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes . . . ? And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder.

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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 12:16 PM

Yes and that brings me back to taking things literally. Maybe the word of God isn't just words. God is more than man, then shouldn't his language be more than our language. Maybe the word of God is mathematics.

I have not read the entire Bible. However, my favorite verse, which I look at every morning is "Have I not commanded you? Be strong and courageous. Do not be afraid; do not be discouraged, for the LORD your God will be with you wherever you go." (Joshua 1:9)
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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 12:24 PM

OK, so it seems like you've dropped a lot of acid and smoked a lot of dope, and these things have given you keen insights. What's next, are you going to wonder if our solar system might be a giant electron and our galaxy a big atom and the universe just one cell in the flesh of a much larger organism?

Put down the hash pipe, buddy.


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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 12:29 PM

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Originally Posted by Faith_Machine View Post
OK, so it seems like you've dropped a lot of acid and smoked a lot of dope, and these things have given you keen insights. What's next, are you going to wonder if our solar system might be a giant electron and our galaxy a big atom and the universe just one cell in the flesh of a much larger organism?

Put down the hash pipe, buddy.
Absolutely not. And I am offended. Not just because you have made these offensive assumptions and generalizations about me, but also that you have wasted my time. It seems that when I say something makes sense, you will just attack me. Is that what you do? In no way have I questioned the Lord. I am merely proposing that he created the universe in the language of mathematics.

Math is much more than just addition and subtraction, it is way beyond us. I cannot even dream of some math. Only God can understand it.
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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 12:29 PM

What reason do you have to think that math is some secret code from God?

Please also bear in mind that when we quote from Scripture, we use only the King James Version.


Mt 21:42, 44 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes . . . ? And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder.

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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 12:34 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pim Pendergast View Post
What reason do you have to think that math is some secret code from God?

Please also bear in mind that when we quote from Scripture, we use only the King James Version.
Simply the elegance and the fact that the universe is bound by it. The "word of God" can be taken in many ways. Why would a being as divine as himself speak in OUR words. He is beyond us, and so is his language. Now, having said that, maybe his language isn't mathematics. But it makes sense that it could be. What makes you believe that God must be bound by a human language?

I apologize for quoting incorrectly.
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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 12:38 PM

God says what He means, and He means what He says. If math was His other language, He would have told us.


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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 12:43 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by MathTechScienceTurd View Post
Simply the elegance and the fact that the universe is bound by it. The "word of God" can be taken in many ways.
Really? REALLY??? I am going to give you the benefit of the doubt here and ask you to kindly explain what you mean.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MathTechScienceTurd View Post
Why would a being as divine as himself speak in OUR words. He is beyond us, and so is his language. Now, having said that, maybe his language isn't mathematics. But it makes sense that it could be. What makes you believe that God must be bound by a human language?
The only possible reason I can see that God would NOT speak to us in our own, human language would be if He did not wish every one of us to be able to understand him. His Holy Scriptures are written in plain, straightforward human language, accessible to all, not in some sort of mathematical notation.

You seem to have some crazy ideas. What is your religious background?

YiC
AW


2 Timothy 3:16

All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:


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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 12:46 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by MathTechScienceTurd View Post
He is beyond us, and so is his language.
Following your logic, then, if math is His language, it's beyond us.


Mt 21:42, 44 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes . . . ? And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder.

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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 12:46 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by MathTechScienceTurd View Post
but also that you have wasted my time
What !?!?!?

So YOU are visiting OUR forum and then you complain that WE are wasting YOUR time !?!?!?

Clearly all that fuzzy math has caused some severe brain damage.


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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 12:50 PM

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Originally Posted by Cranky Old Man View Post
What !?!?!?

So YOU are visiting OUR forum and then you complain that WE are wasting YOUR time !?!?!?

Clearly all that fuzzy math has caused some severe brain damage.
Please, only give me arguments that are worth reading. Simply attacking me is not going to help your cause. It is a waste of your time and my time.
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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 12:55 PM

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Originally Posted by Pim Pendergast View Post
Following your logic, then, if math is His language, it's beyond us.
That is EXACTLY my logic. Mathematics is way beyond human intelligence.

Also, you seem to be the only one on here worth talking to. Why is it that if I say something that is different, I am attacked? If people would like me to change my mind, then why not explanation. We could leave the hate out of here. I never questioned God, his existence, or the fact that he is the creator of everything. I am simply saying that his language must be beyond us, and MAYBE it is mathematics.
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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 12:59 PM

1 Kings 7:23 And he made a molten sea, ten cubits from the one brim to the other: it was round all about, and his height was five cubits: and a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about.


If you follow that mathematically, radius is 5, circumference is 30, therefore pi = 3. As our resident mathematician Dr Snyde, so eloquently point out. How do you feel about that?
Unfortunately, Dr Snyde is on leave at the moment.
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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 01:01 PM

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Originally Posted by MathTechScienceTurd View Post
blah blah blah I have not read the entire Bible. blah blah blah
At least you are being honest. Thank you for that.



You would be amazed at how many people come here and say they've read the Bible ("Cover to cover, I swear!") and then reveal their utter unfamiliarity with the vast majority of it.

Oh sure, they know about The Flood, and The Creation, and some of The Life of Jesus. You know, the basic Sunday School stuff. But do they know about:

- God sending two bears to kill 42 (math!) children for making fun of a guy with male pattern baldness?

- the man who gave some queers his concubine instead of his male house guest, and they raped her all night, and the following day the man cut her up in to 12 (math!) pieces and sent the dismembered parts all over Israel? Heck, he even offered them his daughter!

Of course they don't.

And that is why I want you to get a proper KJV Bible, start at Genesis 1:1 and don't stop until you get to Revelation 22:21. It will only take a few weeks, and then you can speak about God with a little authority.

Yours in Christ (NOT GEORG CANTOR),

Z. Smyth


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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 01:01 PM

Have you accepted Jesus Christ as you personal savior, or haven't you? That's far more important than any of your drug-fueled musings about the nature of the universe.


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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 01:05 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by MathTechScienceTurd View Post
Simply the elegance and the fact that the universe is bound by it.

I apologize for quoting incorrectly.
What evidence do you have that the universe is bound by mathematics? And always was and will be? You have none because as I've told you before you cannot know the universe.

In reality mathematics is an esoteric subject without any practical applicability, learning it or any part of it is simply a waste of time. Time better spent on learning about God.

Some counter proofs to mathematics:
If you have a bucket of water and add another bucketload of water to it, according to mathematics you would have 1+1=2 bucketloads of water, the universe disagrees, the bucket will still contain only a single bucketload of water. Only if God had wanted it to, it could have had two.

The Bible tells us pi is exactly 3 in 1 Kings 7:23. You mathematicians are after thousands of years of trying still no closer to finding the right formula for pi, you guys always end up with a number that is too high. That proves God doesn't conform to your silly pretend mind games about how the universe should look, He only cares about Himself and His followers.


Leviticus 26:15-16
And if ye shall despise my statutes, or if your soul abhor my judgments, so that ye will not do all my commandments, but that ye break my covenant: I also will do this unto you; I will even appoint over you terror, consumption, and the burning ague, that shall consume the eyes, and cause sorrow of heart: and ye shall sow your seed in vain, for your enemies shall eat it.
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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 01:09 PM

I still don't see how math can explain God. How does it shed light on the Trinity?

1 Jn 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

1 + 1 + 1 = 1


Mt 21:42, 44 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord's doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes . . . ? And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder.

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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 01:09 PM

Again, just because the Bible says something, doesn't make it 100% literal or accurate. A circle with radius 5 is equal to 10pi. Maybe your pi=3 theory is an APPROXIMATION. Way back in the day, they didn't have the tools to accurately define a value for pi. And 3 is technically a correct approximation, however not very accurate.

I did know those stories, and just listing a number isn't math.

Also, I'm drug free, and proud. Are you? Maybe you were tripping on acid when you decided pi=3?
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Default Re: Mathematics and God? - 03-07-2014, 01:16 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pim Pendergast View Post
I still don't see how math can explain God. How does it shed light on the Trinity?

1 Jn 5:7 For there are three that bear record in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one.

1 + 1 + 1 = 1
I am not saying that mathematics will explain God. Only he can. I am saying that mathematics can explain the language in which he created the universe in. Not the language to describe it, but the language to create it.

And the divine trinity coming together as one would be:

1/3 + 1/3 + 1/3 = 1
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