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Default GOD is more powerful than Satan, Hitler, Bin Laden & Genghis Khan COMBINED - 11-25-2018, 05:42 PM

A fellow Christian has carefully combed through the Bible and collated verses in order to prove that God is more capable than the combined might of the most powerful men of all time! It doesn't matter if they're literary inventions like Sauron and Darth Vader or figures from the real world like Adolf Hitler and Satan. God trounces them all!



Check out the table:




Looking at these characters from literature and more trivial artforms, it's clear that Anselm was right. Even a dead saint is right twice a millennium.


But they mocked the messengers of God, and despised his words, and misused his prophets, until the wrath of the LORD arose against his people, till there was no remedy. (2 Chronicles 36:16)

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Default Re: GOD is more powerful than Satan, Hitler, Bin Laden & Genghis Khan COMBINED - 11-26-2018, 10:24 AM

And it's nearly a millennium since he was right or wrong about anything. At the height of Anglo-catholicism, Vikings swarming all over the place, Normans (a type of Viking) not to mention Celts, Picts, Scots, Danes, Saxons, Angles, Jutes, Romans (who stayed behind when the Roman empire was trashed by people without boats) it goes on and on: Welsh, Gaels, Cornish, Manxmen & assorted criminals fleeing Spain, Italy, France (other than Normans) probably Russians, Greeks, Moors; the Portuguese were friendlyISH and there were moments of co-operation with the Lowlanders probably; in such a social tombola there was insufficient imagination to fabricate a character more rounded than God?

Who having first conceived the entirety of creation..whether multiple universes or cyclical realities oscillating between matter- and antimatter-universes or even simultaneous developments whoomphing out along mutually indiscernible multi-dimensional axes..then brought it into existence?

Of course not. Anselm was a catholic. He worshipped the pope. Devoid of imagination and crushing original thought as part of his job description. "Be part of our cult or we will kill you," was about as good as it got. Samuel had a different approach:

I Samuel 12:7 Now therefore stand still, that I may reason with you before the LORD of all the righteous acts of the LORD, which he did to you and to your fathers.

Here is the list, linked for reference
  • Exodus 34:14
  • II Samuel 6:7
  • Leviticus 1:9
  • Isaiah 66:1-2
  • Genesis 2:16-17
  • Genesis 7:23
  • Hebrews 4:13
  • I Corinthians 11:8-9
  • Psalm 136:1
  • Matthew 1:18
  • Job 1:12
  • Numbers 16:41-49
  • Matthew 28:18
  • Leviticus 25:44-46
  • Numbers 31:1-47
  • II Kings 2:24
  • I Samuel 15:1-9
  • Isaiah 24:1-13
    • Darth Vader uses fictional cosmology
  • Matthew 25:31-46
  • Jeremiah 32:17
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Default Re: GOD is more powerful than Satan, Hitler, Bin Laden & Genghis Khan COMBINED - 11-26-2018, 12:28 PM

How many "x" would Donald have?


1 Thessalonians 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the TRUMP of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first.
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Default Re: GOD is more powerful than Satan, Hitler, Bin Laden & Genghis Khan COMBINED - 11-26-2018, 09:31 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by MitzaLizalor View Post
...
Thank you very much for the handy links, sister!


But they mocked the messengers of God, and despised his words, and misused his prophets, until the wrath of the LORD arose against his people, till there was no remedy. (2 Chronicles 36:16)

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Default Re: GOD is more powerful than Satan, Hitler, Bin Laden & Genghis Khan COMBINED - 11-27-2018, 01:10 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brother Gonzalez View Post
How many "x" would Donald have?
Some have gone so far as to call Mr Trump the "God Emperor". I don't blaspheme but I can appreciate the sentiment: Trump is certainly God's left-hand man walking among us.

I wouldn't be surprised if Jesus himself gave Trump some personal one-to-one coaching on how to behave as a bastion of the Lord here on Earth. It would explain the modern miracle of Trump 2016. The world was riggin' for Jesus! [1]

As for Don's score, I don't want to get ahead of myself but I could potentially see Trump supplanting Adolf Hitler as the greatest human of all time on this list.

[1] Just as the Romans before. Without them, could Jesus have shown His love for us on the cross? Nope, siree. Jesus needed those Jews to Jew him or else he would've had to do something silly like slit his own throat. But it's nice that He forgave them for the help. What a great guy.


But they mocked the messengers of God, and despised his words, and misused his prophets, until the wrath of the LORD arose against his people, till there was no remedy. (2 Chronicles 36:16)

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Default Re: GOD is more powerful than Satan, Hitler, Bin Laden & Genghis Khan COMBINED - 11-27-2018, 02:48 AM

It was just so anyone could check them if they wished.

I meant to ask about Anselm - was he the one who said that the greatest thing we could imagine would be less great than the thing we'd just imagined actually existing? Therefore since the concept of greatness exists and since we have already imagined (in our minds) something maximally great, then something ACTUALLY maximally great (that is, in reality) would be greater than the thing we'd just imagined existing THEREFORE God exists?

Always struck me as maximally shaky and my point was that not even in the maximally heterogeneous middle ages, particularly in an England swamped with maximally obnoxious "immigrants" across centuries where Anselm was operating just after the Normans turned up, or in the minds of
  • The Joker [4]
    • fictional character

  • Ted Bundy [7]
    • historical character (criminal)
    • deceased
  • Hannibal Lecter [2]
    • fictional character

  • Joseph Kony [10]
    • historical figure

  • Osama bin Laden [7]
    • historical figure
    • now deceased
  • Sauron [10]
    • fictional character

  • Kim Jong Un [9]
    • historical figure

  • Darth Vader [9]
    • fictional character

  • Adolph Hitler [10]
    • historical figure
    • now deceased
  • Genghis Khan [8]
    • historical figure
    • now deceased
  • Satan [6]
    • historical supernatural identity
    • still active
      • DANGEROUS avoid at all costs
(obviously for fictional characters it's the minds of their creators) could something greater than God be conceived. Even the top scorers, viz., Hitler, Sauron & Kony, achieved less than 51% resulting in distorted personalities. I am reluctant to use the word wizened. but here it is appropriate. What could be more wizened than minds seeking great personć for themselves (or their fictional characters) yet so encumbered with sin that a wicked perversion of greatness was the best they could achieve?

I dread to think what Anselm imagined, whatever it was it lacked the self-authenticating witness of The Holy Ghost because he persisted with popes and idols..albeit in an Anglican context..so the maximal greatness he conceived would not be very great and the greater thing greater than tactually existing would be similarly meagre. Vatican city? A grunting toad? Who knows.

For Christians, on the other hand, neither imagination nor logic have any part to play. It's a matter of direct experience. And not experiences of the external world or even "experiences" at all. Vatican stooges do not have it. Toads do not have it. Anglicans do not have it. It's something unique to Christianity:
I Corinthians 2:16 For who hath known the mind of the Lord, that he may instruct him? But we have the mind of Christ.

1. https://plato.stanford.edu/entries/anselm/#ArgPro
. . . .( i ) That than which a greater cannot be thought can be thought.
. . . .( ii ) If that than which a greater cannot be thought can be thought, it exists in reality.
. . . . . . . . . .Therefore,
. . . .( iii ) That than which a greater cannot be thought exists in reality.


2. http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/05431b.htm
. . . .Although the picture of the degradation of the English Church in the first half of the eleventh century which has been drawn by some authorities…is very exaggerated, it is nevertheless certain that even King Edward the Confessor, with all his saintliness, had not been able to repair the damage caused partly by the anarchy of the last ten years of Danish rule, but not less surely, if remotely, by the disorders which for many generations past had existed at the centre of Christendom. Of the prevalence of simoniacal practices, of a scandalous and widespread neglect of the canons enjoining clerical celibacy, and of a general subordination of the ecclesiastical order to secular influences, there is no room for doubt. These evils were at that time almost universal. In 1065, the year of St. Edward's death, things were no better in England than on the Continent of Europe. Probably they were rather worse. But the forces which were to purify and renovate the Church were already at work.
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Default Re: GOD is more powerful than Satan, Hitler, Bin Laden & Genghis Khan COMBINED - 11-27-2018, 05:16 AM

Indeed, the original ontological argument -- that we know of. For all his failings and being wrong and burning in hell, some potential legitimacy to Anselm's argument is shown throughout literature where no author has ever managed to create a character more capable and more powerful than God even in their imaginations (see the chart). Hence the reference to him in this thread.

Of course, Anselm was a filthy papist, now rotting in hell with all the other victims of "canonization". And I call them "victims" because we now know that the trauma of repeated sexual abuse as a child has a tendency to cause gross neurological changes that persist into adulthood, where they attenuate frontal cortical activity and cloud critical thinking capacity. By this mechanism, the catholic factory turned - and, it seems, continues to turn - boys into obedient slaves to a higher power: the fraudulent vessel of God on Earth known as the pope.

I have no doubt that the papal influences on the mind of Anselm had a caustic effect on his philosophy. But I have no desire to know what things he conjured up in his mind while trying to find the greatest possible things of which he could conceive. Frankly, I'm unfamiliar with the back-and-forth of philosophers and theologians and suchlike. I know God exists because the Bible says so and I don't need more than that, especially not poxy thought experiments.

Even so, I'd imagine that belief in a perfect God is more comfortable and comforting than a perfect God existing in an imperfect world where his believers must then reconcile the reality with their perfect idealization. It seems to me that ontological arguments break down around the semantics of "perfect" and "greater"/"greatest". If I remember correctly, having not studied the later ontological arguments for a very long time and never thoroughly, Descartes introduced the notion of existence as a prerequisite of perfection (or "nothing greater", as it may have been formulated). To which my initial objection still applies: why does God get brownie points simply for existing? Why is existing a more impressive feat than creating a perfect world?

Shaky ground, indeed, sister. But please be careful not to strain that delicate female brain of yours any further over such matters. I'm sure there are domestic tasks that would be a much better use of your time than considering the crusty old thoughts of chargrilled old men. Even theistic philosophers have always and will always go to hell because to argue the existence of God, one must first assume that there is an argument to be had: one must countenance the idea of God's non-existence. The Bible must be sufficient to sway a man beyond doubt (Hebrews 11:6). Just as the theologian answers back to God to "interpret" His word, so does the philosopher who argues on God's behalf. Neither man pleases God (Romans 9:20).

Take care, sister.


But they mocked the messengers of God, and despised his words, and misused his prophets, until the wrath of the LORD arose against his people, till there was no remedy. (2 Chronicles 36:16)

The Bible is perfect and contains ZERO contradictions: A True Christian™ guide to logic
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Default Re: GOD is more powerful than Satan, Hitler, Bin Laden & Genghis Khan COMBINED - 11-27-2018, 01:55 PM

I'm afraid all of this discussion is going over my female head. That's why when I see a discussion like this, I print it out and give it to my boys to read. They understand and learn a lot! Thank you!



I also have my husband read it and "dumb it down for me" so that I can get the gist of it. He's very good that that.


Judge in yourselves: is it comely that a woman pray unto God uncovered?
1 Corinthians 11:13
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Default Re: GOD is more powerful than Satan, Hitler, Bin Laden & Genghis Khan COMBINED - 11-27-2018, 03:03 PM

Elijah Mee explained that Anselm was a foul papist so it's no surprise that any logic he used was warped. Popes always look like toads to me. But honestly just trying to write down "imaginary things you imagined but aren't imaginary are greater than imagining the things you imagined aren't imaginary" really highlighted for me what a crock this nonsense really is.

And following his explanation it's plain that it's even more ridiculous than I'd thought or could even imagine. Here's another toad I did for you.

MITRE 1

MITRE 2

MITRE 3

You can click on it for a larger version and I've included links to some pope type hats, appropriately sized, which your boys could mix and match with the amphibian. It may help them to see just how ridiculous pompous papism really is and I'm sure you don't want them marrying catholics. Simply click and drag the graphic(s) to desktop, then copy to your blank page. I'm sure they'll enjoy the lessons available from simple artwork in an educational setting.
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Dana723 is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Dana723 is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Dana723 is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Dana723 is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Dana723 is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Dana723 is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Dana723 is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Dana723 is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Dana723 is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Dana723 is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Dana723 is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.
Default Re: GOD is more powerful than Satan, Hitler, Bin Laden & Genghis Khan COMBINED - 11-28-2018, 12:12 AM

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Originally Posted by MitzaLizalor View Post
Elijah Mee explained that Anselm was a foul papist so it's no surprise that any logic he used was warped. Popes always look like toads to me. But honestly just trying to write down "imaginary things you imagined but aren't imaginary are greater than imagining the things you imagined aren't imaginary" really highlighted for me what a crock this nonsense really is.

And following his explanation it's plain that it's even more ridiculous than I'd thought or could even imagine. Here's another toad I did for you.

MITRE 1

MITRE 2

MITRE 3
You can click on it for a larger version and I've included links to some pope type hats, appropriately sized, which your boys could mix and match with the amphibian. It may help them to see just how ridiculous pompous papism really is and I'm sure you don't want them marrying catholics. Simply click and drag the graphic(s) to desktop, then copy to your blank page. I'm sure they'll enjoy the lessons available from simple artwork in an educational setting.
Thank you! So very kind!


Judge in yourselves: is it comely that a woman pray unto God uncovered?
1 Corinthians 11:13
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Elijah Mee, PhD Elijah Mee, PhD is offline
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Elijah Mee, PhD is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Elijah Mee, PhD is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Elijah Mee, PhD is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Elijah Mee, PhD is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Elijah Mee, PhD is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Elijah Mee, PhD is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Elijah Mee, PhD is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Elijah Mee, PhD is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Elijah Mee, PhD is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Elijah Mee, PhD is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.Elijah Mee, PhD is veritably a saint destined for a place in Heaven near Jesus' right hand.
Default Re: GOD is more powerful than Satan, Hitler, Bin Laden & Genghis Khan COMBINED - 11-28-2018, 10:33 PM

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Originally Posted by Dana723 View Post
I'm afraid all of this discussion is going over my female head. That's why when I see a discussion like this, I print it out and give it to my boys to read. They understand and learn a lot! Thank you!



I also have my husband read it and "dumb it down for me" so that I can get the gist of it. He's very good that that.
I like your attitude. Your boys are going to grow up to be fine lads.


But they mocked the messengers of God, and despised his words, and misused his prophets, until the wrath of the LORD arose against his people, till there was no remedy. (2 Chronicles 36:16)

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