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Default Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 02:26 AM

Hello, my name is John Hamilton, and I'm a twenty-two year old firefighter from Interior Alaska. I was raised as a Baptist when I was a child; my family and I used to go to the First Baptist Church, in Delta Junction, Alaska, but we haven't gone there in years...faith just kind of lost it's importance to my family after what happened to me in Utah when I was twelve. ...I have a lot of hatred, wrath, and pain inside of me. Sometimes I feel like I might die with all the hate in my veins...long story short, I was kidnapped when I was a little kid, and they did things to me that I can't talk about with anyone because it's too graphic and horrific. They kept me hostage for years; there came a point one day where I just didn't care about anything anymore; I became numb, and empty, and just went somewhere else in my head for a while. Day in, day out, the torture and abuse continued. ...I think they liked what they were turning me into; it like...fascinated them, or something. To see a child become so broken inside that nothing matters to him anymore, nothing phases him anymore, and he doesn't feel anything at all anymore. ...They released me when I was seventeen years old, and I simply went back home; thousands of miles away to the arctic tundra of Alaska.

...I told my friends and families that I was able to escape...a lie. I'm not sure why I told them that; my captors simply let me go, released me of their own accord...smiling as they did so; like this was all just some kind of a game or a practical joke of theirs, all done in "good fun" or some sick shit like that.

Coming home felt like coming home for the very first time. I was surprised to find that I didn't actually know exactly where our house was located; as a little kid I never really had to worry about my address or getting home by myself. I knew the general landmarks and area though. ...Felt really surreal walking up my family's driveway again for the first time. It was winter at the time; the forest trees covered in snow on either side of the path turned our driveway into a tunnel of sorts; it was even more beautiful in the summer when the leaves were in full bloom.

There weren't any tracks in the snow; everything was clean, pure and pristine. So much in contrast to what my soul had turned into, my footprints looking so alone behind me. I could hardly believe my eyes when I finally reached our house and saw it again for the first time in years. For some reason it never occurred to me that my family not be here anymore; maybe they had moved away. Maybe I just knew subconsciously that they were still waiting for me, clinging onto the hope that I was still alive and would one day find my way back home.

For some reason though I was nervous about seeing them again; just a little. Would they even recognize me anymore? I didn't ponder it for long; didn't even lose a step moving to the front door, reaching my hand out to knock on the hard wood, as if I were merely a visitor, and needed to be invited inside my own home. Nothing. Knocked again. It was late; maybe they were asleep. Knocked again. I heard noises inside then; someone stumbling out of bed, the floorboards creaking as they approached to answer the door. It was my father. He looked tired. He had gray hairs on his head now. I'd grown over a foot. At first I don't think he quite recognized me, but only for a split second. "Hi dad." I said, just in case he needed me to confirm it. His jaw was hanging open, closing, opening, closing, and dropping again. ...It kinda scared me; I thought maybe he was having some kind of an episode haha; didn't want him to have a heart attack. That'd be a pretty shitty reunion lol. XD

He regained his composure though, and hurried me inside, and hugged me tight; we've never hugged each other so tight and so long before in my life. Mom came out a few moments later. Her reaction was about the same. I didn't say anything; just ran to her to embrace her in a big hug as well. ....She totally freaked later when I got out of the shower; seeing my body covered in scars from head to toe, blazing white against my reddish skin (I took a boiling hot shower; a habit that probably started then...I kinda like physical pain now.)

...It was until the next day though that things started to really sink in for me though. ...Everything was different now. Everything in our house seemed so much smaller to me now; fragile and delicate. I could now nearly press my hand against the ceiling, whereas the last time I had been there I could never hope to reach the ceiling, not even if I jumped as high as my little body could. ...My room wasn't much different though. My parents couldn't bring themselves to clean it out. Still looked like a a little boy's room, with stuffed animals and action figures and other toys and games. ...Felt kind of out of place there; I remember having so much fun playing in there...but I didn't know how to play with toys anymore; I don't know how to pretend or make-believe anymore.

The town itself had changed a bit as well; business had picked up on the missile defense base, bringing in a bunch of new people, boosting the population by hundreds if not thousands...it used to be a little town where everyone knew everyone else. Now there were a bunch of new buildings and houses and families and everything was different....kinda started sinking in then the awful truth behind the words "You can never go home again." I'm a total stranger to my former family and friends now. Some of them can tell; saying "You've changed..." with mixed-emotions; like they couldn't tell what changed, and for better or for worse, just that something was very different about me now.

Some of the adults knew my story; knew that I'd been taken as a little boy. They always look at me with sad faces now. My old friends? They thought it was so cool; like I'd just come back from the dead or something. None of their parents ever told them the truth about why I had disappeared all of a sudden, because little kids should never have to be told shit like that about one of their best friends; that he was taken by monsters and twisted into something inhuman, cold, and heartless. ...But that didn't keep them from talking; none of them ever stopped talking about the little boy who disappeared. ...I'd become a ghost story. The former grade school children I used to be friends with were now in high school. I tried high school for a little while...like a week, lol...I couldn't take it. Got into fights a lot. It freaked me out being around so many people. Lots of loud noises; freaked me out too. So I dropped out. Got hooked on drugs and alcohol to numb the pain, but mostly because I felt like that's just what teenagers were supposed to do lol; my attempt at trying to be normal again, and just....fit in. Surprised the shit out of my parents; the last time they'd seen me I was a totally straight and narrow little kid; huge Jesus freak back then too; I used to love God....but I haven't in a very long time. I don't know if there even is a God to be honest, but in recent times, there are days when I Believe....and others when I've lost all faith. Today is not one of those days though. Today, I want to believe. Maybe it's just because I finished watching an extremely powerful movie entitled "The Shack".....it really spoke to me.

....Anyway....I'm sorry; I kinda got stuck rambling on there for a while.

PS: I don't really have a favorite Bible Verse. =/ .....I guess if I had to pick one, it would probably be "To everything, there is a proper time, and proper place, for everything under the Heaven." or something like that....I think it's from the book of Ecclesiastes if I recall correctly. I think chapter three; the first eight verses basically just sums up that there's a time and a place for everything...including destruction, hatred, and war....and again; some days I believe in that more than other days....if I had a choice, (and maybe I do?) I'd probably choose to be a pacifist.....but it might be too late for that......maybe not.....like the title says; I'm lost.


--John
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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 02:50 AM

Goodness you're a long-winded young man, aren't you? Just remember, Jesus doesn't like a complainer. So are you married yet? Perhaps the Palins have a few extra girls up there in Alaska. I wouldn't know, as I stopped following them when their oldest one flaunted her bastard baby all over the television. Jesus doesn't like bastards either, so I'm in good company (Deuteronomy 23:2). I hope those Mormons didn't crush your seed sack. That's also not okay in Jesus' book (Deuteronomy 23:1). Anyway, welcome to the forums!


Hello, my name is Mary. I hope to fellowship with you! That is, unless you don't listen to church authority (Deuteronomy 17:12); are a witch (Exodus 22:17); are a homosexual (Leviticus 20:13; Romans 1:24-32); or fortuneteller (Leviticus 20:27) or a snotty kid who hits their dad (Exodus 21:15); or curses their parents (Proverbs 20:20; Leviticus 20:9); an adulterer (Leviticus 20:10); a non-Christian (Exodus 22:19; Deuteronomy 13:7-12; Deuteronomy 17:2-5;Romans 1:24-32); an atheist (2 Chronicles 15:12-13); or false prophet (Zechariah 13:3); from the town of one who worships another, false god (Deuteronomy 13:13-19); were a non-virgin bride (Deuteronomy 22:20-21); or blasphemer (Leviticus 24:10-16), as God calls for your execution and will no doubt send you to Hell, and I have no interest developing a friendship with the Spiritually Walking Dead.

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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 03:59 AM

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Originally Posted by Mary Etheldreda View Post
Goodness you're a long-winded young man, aren't you?
I suppose I can be; I have a lot of thoughts. In person I'm actually a pretty quiet individual; I communicate in writing much more effectively than verbally. I guess there's no singular reason as to why; it's partly because I simply don't go outside of my bedroom, (which has since been redone to make it more age-appropriate lol), unless the fire alarm tone starts blaring on my radio; my cue to go to work, and at work, I'm just not that into socializing because I have to focus on the job and staying alive, then when the fire(s) are out I just go back home, fix myself, up and go back to bed. Those are really the only times I'm actually around other people, aside from buzzing into town to check the mail or pick up some groceries for my parents or sister, during which times I don't talk with people unless the situation demands it; it's all just business as usual. I don't really have any friends to go hang out with; all my old ones moved out of their folks' house a long time ago and have since relocated the Lower 48. ...I wouldn't even really know what to talk about with them anyway; I'm not really good at small-talk, and I have difficulty speaking up sometimes; when I do talk it's at a low to medium volume, sometimes a mumble, occasionally with some stuttering. I say weird things sometimes/have strange views occasionally. I don't really like people in general, too; another reason why I'm not interested in actually engaging in social conversation with them; mostly because a part of me is just scared of people; sees them as animals, driven by instinct in a fight for survival, who could one moment be sweet and cuddly, until perhaps one of their security blankets are removed, (let's just say they weren't able to sleep the night before), and then all of a sudden they just snap and devour you alive. ....I kinda have trust issues I guess lmao.

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Just remember, Jesus doesn't like a complainer.
I'm not sure about that to be honest; part of me doesn't believe in Jesus; part of me believes he was a real person, but merely a wise spiritual teacher in the middle-east a little over a couple thousand years ago. Still, another part of me believes Jesus is God; part of the "holy trinity" spoken of in the Bible, and that he, being a part of God, is all "Good" and sees me as his child, perhaps feeling frustrated that I make bad choices sometimes; other times feeling sad and hurt when he sees me in pain, as any father would towards his son. ...That part of me believes that there's probably nothing I could do to make Jesus dislike me, because it's not in His nature to hate, because He is a force of pure, un-corrupted "good"....I dunno if I'm making any sense or not; I can be a little complicated.

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So are you married yet? Perhaps the Palins have a few extra girls up there in Alaska. I wouldn't know, as I stopped following them when their oldest one flaunted her bastard baby all over the television.
Nope; I'm not married yet. I'm not really interested in girls or marriage. Ever since coming back, I've kinda shied away from any kind of romantic relationship. Girls would hit on me during my very brief stint in high school; I'd turn them all down, getting baffled responses from my old buddies. None of them could understand why I'd reject girls, especially when they were smoking hot lol. ...I just don't feel like I could ever really "be there" for them, emotionally speaking or sexually speaking. I have a plethora of my own emotional issues to worry about; too much to add another person's emotional issues, which would be a part of marriage; being there for her through sickness and health. ...I might be a bit of a sociopath. It's not so much so that I don't feel emotions anymore, so much as I just don't feel them the same way as normal people/have more difficulty placing my finger on what it is I'm feeling exactly, unless it's something primitive like fear or rage. I'm almost always "emotionally conflicted", seeing things from multiple different points of view at the same time. (It feels just as confusing as it sounds written out like that lol).

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Jesus doesn't like bastards either, so I'm in good company (Deuteronomy 23:2).
...Isn't a bastard simply a child/individual that doesn't have a father present in their lives? I agree that it's extremely important for a child to have a father and a mother, but I wouldn't blame or condemn the child if their father wasn't present; I'd feel sad for them, and wished the world wasn't so unfair sometimes.


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I hope those Mormons didn't crush your seed sack. That's also not okay in Jesus' book (Deuteronomy 23:1). Anyway, welcome to the forums!
Indeed; Mormons are extremely misguided haha (and the people who kidnapped me were actually Mormon by the way; they'd often quote the Book of Mormon to me when they weren't...doing what they were doing when they weren't preaching about how they're going to be gods with their own planets to rule with all the women they could desire. It made me physically sick. .....I know that if God is real, He wants me to forgive those animals for what they did.....that's part of the reason I lost my faith in the first place; I don't know if I can ever forgive them. .....I want them dead....I want them to suffer, in every way that they made me and so many other little boys suffer......hating them feels so good sometimes.....other times it just makes me feel sick to my stomach; it gets to be too much sometimes. Again, drugs help during those moments haha; helps me to just forget about it for a short time; let go of my hatred and anger and just float in a psychedelic trance where all is soft and comfy and peaceful.

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Anyway, welcome to the forums!
Thanks for the welcome? ....

--John
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Love Jesus Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 04:15 AM

Hello and to our Godly forum, John!

I like your choice of the favorite verse.

Ecclesiastes 3:1-3
1 To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven:
2 A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted;
3 A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up;

Most people who call themselves Christian claim God to be all about peace and love like some weed-loving hippie. They ignore the 99% of the Bible which teaches that God is also capable of hatred and revenge (be it through death, be it through torture). There is some time that God spends on love... and there's also other time God which spends on punishing those whom He considers to be wicked. Or whom He just feels like punishing.

It looks like you have been on a very sad life journey so far. You might find solace reading about Job - like you, he was also tormented by God for no other reason but the fact that God was bored and agreed to place a bet with the devil:

Job 1:6-12
6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.
7 And the Lord said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
8 And the Lord said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?
9 Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, Doth Job fear God for nought?
10 Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.
11 But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face.
12 And the Lord said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the Lord.

I will pray for you.
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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 05:22 AM

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Originally Posted by Basilissa View Post
Hello and to our Godly forum, John!
Thank you very much for the warm welcome, sir.

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Originally Posted by Basilissa View Post
I like your choice of the favorite verse.

Ecclesiastes 3:1-3
1 To every thing there is a season, and a time to every purpose under the heaven:
2 A time to be born, and a time to die; a time to plant, and a time to pluck up that which is planted;
3 A time to kill, and a time to heal; a time to break down, and a time to build up;
Thanks; it's one of the only ones I'm aware of so far that I felt I could wholeheartedly believe in. It's a very liberating series of verses in a sense. I believe the most important part of it is attaining the wisdom to know the proper times and places for various actions, particularly when it comes to the more unsavory actions such as killing and war. ...I know what it's like to want to murder a bunch of people...I'm still not sure if I'm ever going to go through with it or not. Would it be justified? Probably. Would it save lives in the future? Sure it would. ....But still...a little voice somewhere inside me says to me "This is not the Way." And so I don't...I won't kill unless there is truly no other option...and a part of me wants to believe that there is always another way, but there probably isn't. Sometimes it all comes down to making a hard choice, repenting for any wrong you may have done, then doing your best to make the most out of it....turn something bad into something good.....like turning water into wine, or lead into gold.

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Originally Posted by Basilissa View Post
Most people who call themselves Christian claim God to be all about peace and love like some weed-loving hippie. They ignore the 99% of the Bible which teaches that God is also capable of hatred and revenge (be it through death, be it through torture). There is some time that God spends on love... and there's also other time God which spends on punishing those whom He considers to be wicked. Or whom He just feels like punishing.
...I smoke weed lol. XD ...And my mom was one of the founding mothers of the Hippie movement back in the 60s lmao. XD She's tried to get me more on the hippie train too, and maybe I am a little bit, but I like to think I'm more realistic about it than she is. She's almost seventy years old; she can afford to be all peace and love all the time; she's not gonna be around all that much longer anyway haha, but me? I got my whole life ahead of me still; bad things are going to happen that I'm gonna have to deal with lol. Once upon a time there were three cavemen who spotted a stranger running towards them with a spear. One fled, one fought, and the other smiled and invited the stranger over for fondue. That last caveman didn't survive long enough to procreate. That's why I'm a bit of a pessimist at times lol.

In regards to the Bible, I try to carry a healthy skepticism when reading it; looking within, trying to listen to that little voice for the answers and truth (that little voice that convinces me to not commit mass murder when I'm feeling enraged with the depths of evil in this world lmao). I love the Bible, even though I may not believe it all; it's easily the greatest book on the planet that I know of. If I could only bring one book with my in my bug out bag in a SHTF scenario, it would be the Bible lol. It has every genre you could possibly want; action, adventure, drama, comedy, romance, horror, family, science fiction/fantasy, you name it, it's there lol. ....And it was written by men. I believe it's important to keep that last fact in mind when reading the Bible for spiritual purposes (as opposed to recreational purposes). God is infallible. Mankind is not. It's not too far of a reach for me to believe that there are things in the Bible which are pure horseshit simply because a man or group of men decided that it was in their own best interests to say something wrong is something right, because way back then, Religion wasn't just a personal spiritual thing for people; it was EVERYTHING lol; entire governments and civilizations where based solely on Religious laws and dogmas; there was no democracy of any kind in which people would elect a leader or vote on the rules they'd all follow lol. ...Just food for thought; something to consider when reading certain things in the Bible such as "kill all the witches" or "rip your eyeball out if it caused you to sin" lmao. That's just plain goofy. XD


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Originally Posted by Basilissa View Post
It looks like you have been on a very sad life journey so far. You might find solace reading about Job - like you, he was also tormented by God for no other reason but the fact that God was bored and agreed to place a bet with the devil:

Job 1:6-12
6 Now there was a day when the sons of God came to present themselves before the Lord, and Satan came also among them.
7 And the Lord said unto Satan, Whence comest thou? Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, From going to and fro in the earth, and from walking up and down in it.
8 And the Lord said unto Satan, Hast thou considered my servant Job, that there is none like him in the earth, a perfect and an upright man, one that feareth God, and escheweth evil?
9 Then Satan answered the Lord, and said, Doth Job fear God for nought?
10 Hast not thou made an hedge about him, and about his house, and about all that he hath on every side? thou hast blessed the work of his hands, and his substance is increased in the land.
11 But put forth thine hand now, and touch all that he hath, and he will curse thee to thy face.
12 And the Lord said unto Satan, Behold, all that he hath is in thy power; only upon himself put not forth thine hand. So Satan went forth from the presence of the Lord.
Indeed. I've actually begged for death before. I mean literally; not figuratively as in I was just wishing it in my head or sarcastically saying "God kill me now." I mean literally on my knees, begging out loud for them to just piffleing kill me already. People joke about begging for death all the time; kind of a pet peeve of mine because they just have no idea what they're talking about; very few people have ever been placed into a situation where death would LITERALLY be a BLESSING. I welcome death with open arms; that's how fun my life has been lmao. XD

In regards to Job, I think Satan was wrong for assuming God gave Job all that was good for him. I don't believe God gives us valuables when we're good lol; likewise, I don't believe God punishes us when we're bad. I believe Sin itself is it's own punishment and torment. It always leads to death or destruction, usually both. For example, if I decide to act out on my intense desires for vengeance, go back to Utah, and slaughter every last one of those motherpiffleers who tortured me for five years where NOTHING good happened, not only would my hands be stained with the blood of my "neighbors" lmao, but I'd likely get caught by the cops, locked up, probably sentenced to death (Utah has a very extensive policy on Capital Punishment lol; they get real....creative, lmao). But not before getting raped and tortured even more on death row. So what would my vengeance have really done for me in the end? Would it make me feel any better? ....Probably not. ...Vengeance is mine, saith the Lord. Only parents and legal guardians are allowed to discipline their children....



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I will pray for you.
Thanks. Hope it helps.


--John
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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 06:07 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Hamilton View Post
I suppose I can be; I have a lot of thoughts. In person I'm actually a pretty quiet individual; I communicate in writing much more effectively than verbally. I guess there's no singular reason as to why; it's partly because I simply don't go outside of my bedroom, (which has since been redone to make it more age-appropriate lol), unless the fire alarm tone starts blaring on my radio; my cue to go to work, and at work, I'm just not that into socializing because I have to focus on the job and staying alive, then when the fire(s) are out I just go back home, fix myself, up and go back to bed. Those are really the only times I'm actually around other people, aside from buzzing into town to check the mail or pick up some groceries for my parents or sister, during which times I don't talk with people unless the situation demands it; it's all just business as usual. I don't really have any friends to go hang out with; all my old ones moved out of their folks' house a long time ago and have since relocated the Lower 48. ...I wouldn't even really know what to talk about with them anyway; I'm not really good at small-talk, and I have difficulty speaking up sometimes; when I do talk it's at a low to medium volume, sometimes a mumble, occasionally with some stuttering. I say weird things sometimes/have strange views occasionally. I don't really like people in general, too; another reason why I'm not interested in actually engaging in social conversation with them; mostly because a part of me is just scared of people; sees them as animals, driven by instinct in a fight for survival, who could one moment be sweet and cuddly, until perhaps one of their security blankets are removed, (let's just say they weren't able to sleep the night before), and then all of a sudden they just snap and devour you alive. ....I kinda have trust issues I guess lmao.



I'm not sure about that to be honest; part of me doesn't believe in Jesus; part of me believes he was a real person, but merely a wise spiritual teacher in the middle-east a little over a couple thousand years ago. Still, another part of me believes Jesus is God; part of the "holy trinity" spoken of in the Bible, and that he, being a part of God, is all "Good" and sees me as his child, perhaps feeling frustrated that I make bad choices sometimes; other times feeling sad and hurt when he sees me in pain, as any father would towards his son. ...That part of me believes that there's probably nothing I could do to make Jesus dislike me, because it's not in His nature to hate, because He is a force of pure, un-corrupted "good"....I dunno if I'm making any sense or not; I can be a little complicated.



Nope; I'm not married yet. I'm not really interested in girls or marriage. Ever since coming back, I've kinda shied away from any kind of romantic relationship. Girls would hit on me during my very brief stint in high school; I'd turn them all down, getting baffled responses from my old buddies. None of them could understand why I'd reject girls, especially when they were smoking hot lol. ...I just don't feel like I could ever really "be there" for them, emotionally speaking or sexually speaking. I have a plethora of my own emotional issues to worry about; too much to add another person's emotional issues, which would be a part of marriage; being there for her through sickness and health. ...I might be a bit of a sociopath. It's not so much so that I don't feel emotions anymore, so much as I just don't feel them the same way as normal people/have more difficulty placing my finger on what it is I'm feeling exactly, unless it's something primitive like fear or rage. I'm almost always "emotionally conflicted", seeing things from multiple different points of view at the same time. (It feels just as confusing as it sounds written out like that lol).



...Isn't a bastard simply a child/individual that doesn't have a father present in their lives? I agree that it's extremely important for a child to have a father and a mother, but I wouldn't blame or condemn the child if their father wasn't present; I'd feel sad for them, and wished the world wasn't so unfair sometimes.




Indeed; Mormons are extremely misguided haha (and the people who kidnapped me were actually Mormon by the way; they'd often quote the Book of Mormon to me when they weren't...doing what they were doing when they weren't preaching about how they're going to be gods with their own planets to rule with all the women they could desire. It made me physically sick. .....I know that if God is real, He wants me to forgive those animals for what they did.....that's part of the reason I lost my faith in the first place; I don't know if I can ever forgive them. .....I want them dead....I want them to suffer, in every way that they made me and so many other little boys suffer......hating them feels so good sometimes.....other times it just makes me feel sick to my stomach; it gets to be too much sometimes. Again, drugs help during those moments haha; helps me to just forget about it for a short time; let go of my hatred and anger and just float in a psychedelic trance where all is soft and comfy and peaceful.



Thanks for the welcome? ....

--John
Well that's nice. What are you doing to find a young bride? Landover Baptist Church has a very helpful guide, found HERE. You can join the conversation or ask questions HERE.



Hello, my name is Mary. I hope to fellowship with you! That is, unless you don't listen to church authority (Deuteronomy 17:12); are a witch (Exodus 22:17); are a homosexual (Leviticus 20:13; Romans 1:24-32); or fortuneteller (Leviticus 20:27) or a snotty kid who hits their dad (Exodus 21:15); or curses their parents (Proverbs 20:20; Leviticus 20:9); an adulterer (Leviticus 20:10); a non-Christian (Exodus 22:19; Deuteronomy 13:7-12; Deuteronomy 17:2-5;Romans 1:24-32); an atheist (2 Chronicles 15:12-13); or false prophet (Zechariah 13:3); from the town of one who worships another, false god (Deuteronomy 13:13-19); were a non-virgin bride (Deuteronomy 22:20-21); or blasphemer (Leviticus 24:10-16), as God calls for your execution and will no doubt send you to Hell, and I have no interest developing a friendship with the Spiritually Walking Dead.

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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 06:10 AM

Hello Mr. Hamilton. I am deeply moved by your story. I understand that some sort of faith in something, which you have expressed, is probably what keeps you sane. Nonetheless, I have some questions regarding the internal coherence of your belief system.


Quote:
Originally Posted by John Hamilton View Post
I don't know if there even is a God to be honest, but in recent times, there are days when I Believe....and others when I've lost all faith. Today is not one of those days though. Today, I want to believe.
I understand exactly where you are coming from. Christian religion is deeply illogical and hard to believe, and Christian God is a cruel and sadistic being. It's really hard to worship such a psychopath... especially since we have no evidence whatsoever that He exists, anyway. Nonetheless, the fear of eternal damnation is a good reason to worship Him...


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if I had a choice, (and maybe I do?) I'd probably choose to be a pacifist.....but it might be too late for that......maybe not.....like the title says; I'm lost.
Well, I don't think you are lost. People aren't set in stone, we can always change. Improve. Evolve.

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Hamilton View Post
part of me doesn't believe in Jesus; part of me believes he was a real person, but merely a wise spiritual teacher in the middle-east a little over a couple thousand years ago.

That is an intriguing belief indeed, however, there is no actual historical evidence that such a person actually existed. At least Christians have the Bible as their proof that Jesus is God; but with this idea of yours, you have nothing.


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Still, another part of me believes Jesus is God; part of the "holy trinity" spoken of in the Bible, and that he, being a part of God, is all "Good"
Biblical God is not good. He is cruel and merciless, killing little babies whenever He wants to. If you look at the history of the world, and all wars fought in the name of God, and all genocides justified by religion, and all forms of oppression also justified by religion, God is even more sadistic than the Bible portrays Him as. At least, the Biblical God rewards good people; real history God seems to enjoy all the bloodshed, slavery, torture, oppression of women, etc, done in His name.


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That part of me believes that there's probably nothing I could do to make Jesus dislike me, because it's not in His nature to hate, because He is a force of pure, un-corrupted "good"....I dunno if I'm making any sense or not; I can be a little complicated.
No, you are not making much sense. I'm not a Bible scholar, but the True Christians here may point you to verses where God admits that He creates evil and enjoys making people suffer.


He did create people who kidnapped you, didn't He?

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I know that if God is real, He wants me to forgive those animals for what they did.....
You cannot know that since you don't know anything about His nature. And as I mentioned before, the clues provided by the Bible and history are not very promising in this regard.

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Hamilton View Post
Thanks; it's one of the only ones I'm aware of so far that I felt I could wholeheartedly believe in. It's a very liberating series of verses in a sense. I believe the most important part of it is attaining the wisdom to know the proper times and places for various actions, particularly when it comes to the more unsavory actions such as killing and war. ...I know what it's like to want to murder a bunch of people...I'm still not sure if I'm ever going to go through with it or not. Would it be justified? Probably. Would it save lives in the future? Sure it would. ....But still...a little voice somewhere inside me says to me "This is not the Way."

Indeed. In this country, we have laws and police to deal with stuff like that. You should not do anything stupid, just contact appropriate authorities. Which, by the way, you should have done when the evidence of physical abuse was still visible all over your body.


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...And my mom was one of the founding mothers of the Hippie movement back in the 60s lmao.
Did it hinder much with her being a practicing Baptist, as you mentioned in your first post?


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Once upon a time there were three cavemen who spotted a stranger running towards them with a spear. One fled, one fought, and the other smiled and invited the stranger over for fondue. That last caveman didn't survive long enough to procreate. That's why I'm a bit of a pessimist at times lol.
Yet the human species overall managed to survive thanks to cooperation, and not killing each other. There was some violence in the remote past of our species, but the really incessant killings started after the advent of agriculture. You know, around the time when organized religions became a thing.

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In regards to the Bible, I try to carry a healthy skepticism when reading it;
I highly encourage you to read some of Mesopotamian literature, then, as large chunks of the Bible have been copied and pasted from it. That will help to increase your skepticism levels.


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looking within, trying to listen to that little voice for the answers and truth
You might want to be careful with listening to voices that nobody else hears. Modern medicine has diagnosed that as schizophrenia and it is manageable with appropriate medications.


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I love the Bible, even though I may not believe it all; it's easily the greatest book on the planet that I know of.
Which parts do you enjoy the most? About bashing baby heads into stones? Ripping pregnant women's bellies open? Eternal torture of everyone who did not accept Jesus as their Savior?


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If I could only bring one book with my in my bug out bag in a SHTF scenario, it would be the Bible lol. It has every genre you could possibly want; action, adventure, drama, comedy, romance, horror, family, science fiction/fantasy, you name it, it's there lol. ....
I'll have to agree with you here.


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And it was written by men. I believe it's important to keep that last fact in mind when reading the Bible for spiritual purposes
Yep. By elite men for elite men. Definitely not by women. And not by slaves. And not by oppressed ethnicities.


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It's not too far of a reach for me to believe that there are things in the Bible which are pure horseshit simply because a man or group of men decided that it was in their own best interests to say something wrong is something right,
I understand you logic. Nonetheless, on what criteria would you chose which parts of the Bible are true and which are false? I mean, by that logic, 90% or even 100% of the Bible could be false.


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way back then, Religion wasn't just a personal spiritual thing for people; it was EVERYTHING lol; entire governments and civilizations where based solely on Religious laws and dogmas; there was no democracy of any kind in which people would elect a leader or vote on the rules they'd all follow lol.
Just like the USA - no way a Jew, an atheist, or a Muslim could be elected president.


No. Effing. Way.


What were you saying, about that being "in the past"?


John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 11:30 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
Hello Mr. Hamilton. I am deeply moved by your story. I understand that some sort of faith in something, which you have expressed, is probably what keeps you sane. Nonetheless, I have some questions regarding the internal coherence of your belief system.
Technically I'm not sane. I have a condition called Complex Posttraumatic Stress Disorder. Formerly known as "Shell Shock" lmao. It's kinda like regular PTSD, except with some "mild psychotic features".


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
I understand exactly where you are coming from. Christian religion is deeply illogical and hard to believe, and Christian God is a cruel and sadistic being. It's really hard to worship such a psychopath... especially since we have no evidence whatsoever that He exists, anyway. Nonetheless, the fear of eternal damnation is a good reason to worship Him...
I don't believe that, personally....I used to though. I used to hate God with a passion; so angry at Him for not saving me from those monsters. I still remember praying to Him night after night year after year for Him to do something, anything to save me...but no one ever came. ...That's what originally made me lose faith; I even thought for a while that I was simply coming to terms with reality by telling myself there's no God. But over the years, I started getting angry at God; blaming Him for not doing anything, accusing Him of doing it to me on purpose even. The anger then turned to hatred...then I had an epiphany of sorts one day: ...How could I genuinely hate and blame something that I don't believe exists? That's when I realized that God never actually left me; I never really stopped believing in Him deep down....It's only been the past two couple days or so though that I've finally been able to admit that.

......God gave humanity free will according to the Bible. What they decide to do with their freedom of choice....isn't God's fault. That's kind of hard for me to say, but it's true to me now....feels weird to say. I don't know why God didn't save me....but I do believe God can work incredible good out of tragedies, but that doesn't necessarily mean that He orchestrated the tragedies to begin with.....If I'm to believe in God, I guess I'll have to believe in the Devil as well....The Prince of Darkness/Prince of Lies, the Deceiver, The Evil One...Satan. ...Maybe he's behind all the sin and tragedy in the world...NOT my father in Heaven?

Also, if I recall correctly, there's a place in the Bible that says Hell is specifically reserved for the Devil and his Fallen Angels; both of which are non-human entities; that Hell was never intended for the punishment of God's Children?

I could very well be mistaken. ...But didn't Jesus dying on the Cross save us ALL in that moment; He died for our sins, right? So that we'd never have to face the fires of Hell for our sins, because everyone of us will fall short of being absolutely perfect and without sin?


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Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
Well, I don't think you are lost. People aren't set in stone, we can always change. Improve. Evolve.
Indeed.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
That is an intriguing belief indeed, however, there is no actual historical evidence that such a person actually existed. At least Christians have the Bible as their proof that Jesus is God; but with this idea of yours, you have nothing.
You might want to read a copy of "Killing Jesus" by Bill O'Reilly. It's basically a down-to-earth historical account of the life and death of Jesus; what the government of the area was like, Herod's slaughtering of the firstborn in an attempt to kill the one that was to become the Christ, etc. There's at least enough circumstantial historical evidence to conclude that there really was a dude named Jesus who was possibly quite the rabble rouser to say the least. XD (The Romans by the way were excellent record-keepers.)



Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
Biblical God is not good. He is cruel and merciless, killing little babies whenever He wants to. If you look at the history of the world, and all wars fought in the name of God, and all genocides justified by religion, and all forms of oppression also justified by religion, God is even more sadistic than the Bible portrays Him as. At least, the Biblical God rewards good people; real history God seems to enjoy all the bloodshed, slavery, torture, oppression of women, etc, done in His name.
Dang; where in the Bible does it say God killed babies whenever He wanted??? Only one I know of who slaughtered infant children by the multitude was King Herod if I recall correctly; because a star popped up out of nowhere apparently no less lmao. What a douche. XD

I know that it is written God is jealous, but where does it say he is cruel and merciless?

In regards to all the un-holy wars fought in the name of God, I have to agree that it's utterly detestable....But I don't believe God literally TOLD those armies to fight each other; is was the Free Choice of humanity to engage in war, perhaps because Satan set everything in motion, too. Trust me; I know what it's like to be at the hands of merciless psychopaths who think they're carrying out the Will of God....like I've said; people need to be careful what they put Faith into, or it can really mess them up.....and everything spirals into chaos.....I can't believe that's God's Plan; I feel in my soul that He's just as hurt and heartbroken as I am by all the tragedy and death in the world, especially the acts of evil carried out in His name. ....Probably makes Satan real happy though.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
No, you are not making much sense. I'm not a Bible scholar, but the True Christians here may point you to verses where God admits that He creates evil and enjoys making people suffer.
I think I do recall a verse where God admits to creating evil, but I definitely don't recall any verses where He says that he ENJOYS making people suffer; I'd like a quote from the Bible on that if anyone can provide it.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
He did create people who kidnapped you, didn't He?
Indirectly, yes; He created Adam and Eve, and everything just kind of went downhill from there; I'm sure you know the story.

....And the people who kidnapped me? .....They used to be little kids too, once upon a time. .....They probably got messed up by their Mormon parents. ....Maybe they were just doing to me what was done to me because of what happened to them. .....Doesn't mean that it's God's fault; I can't blame or Judge him.....I dunno if I can even blame or Judge the ones who took me.....I used to feel so much hatred and anger at them and at God; back when I actually did blame Him for everything that happened. .......But if they'd never taken me.....I never would have known who they are and what they do to countless other children.....what they're probably doing to another little boy just like me right this moment.....maybe some good actually can come from this tragedy....Maybe God is good. ....It's taken me a really long time to let go of my hate and anger enough to even begin to be able to see all this.....I was so blind.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
You cannot know that since you don't know anything about His nature. And as I mentioned before, the clues provided by the Bible and history are not very promising in this regard.
You're right; I can't really know anything, now can I? Call it a "gut feeling" I guess......heh, or....maybe even "Faith".


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
Indeed. In this country, we have laws and police to deal with stuff like that. You should not do anything stupid, just contact appropriate authorities. Which, by the way, you should have done when the evidence of physical abuse was still visible all over your body.
Oh I did. They looked into it. The people who kidnapped me lawyered up; real fancy one. Apparently they were millionaires. They got off on a technicality. They still roam free. ......So much for the police. There's nothing I can do.....nothing legal anyway. I'm just a small town farm boy; well below and under the poverty line. Sadly these days there isn't actually "Justice for all" in a court of law; only for those who can pay the right price.....another thing that makes me feel so angry it makes me sick.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
Did it hinder much with her being a practicing Baptist, as you mentioned in your first post?
Lmao; my mom wasn't a Baptist in the rockin' sixties haha XD. She was a Wiccan teenager with some real eclectic eastern philosophy New Age beliefs XD. I wouldn't have even recognized her lmao. XD

She's still not a Baptist; both my parents seemed to lose their Faith after I disappeared....just like me.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
Yet the human species overall managed to survive thanks to cooperation, and not killing each other. There was some violence in the remote past of our species, but the really incessant killings started after the advent of agriculture. You know, around the time when organized religions became a thing.
Indeed; I need to keep this in mind more; might help me stop being so afraid of the world as much; maybe even get myself out there a little. I've never really been a fan of Organized Religion; always seems to drift away from spirituality and actually building a personal relationship with God; organized religious settings just don't seem to leave as much room for genuine discussion of ideas; it's not okay to question or ask "why?", it seems. I'm a very questing individual; religion is a personal thing to me; not so much a group thing. We're all God's Children in my mind; all children need a little special attention from time to time; love and kindness, perhaps even different methods of learning and development; what works well for one may not work well for all.



Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
I highly encourage you to read some of Mesopotamian literature, then, as large chunks of the Bible have been copied and pasted from it. That will help to increase your skepticism levels.
Indeed! I have actually studied those stories; they're truly fascinating.

Indeed; it's truly eerie how similar so many different stories from so many different cultures are; how really all of these stories are actually re-tellings of the same story.

On the contrary, this fact doesn't increase my skepticism, so much as confirms for me that I might be on the right track; how on earth could primitive cultures in South America, (never-mind the Sumerians and Mesopotanians mythologies lol), POSSIBLY make up a story that almost exactly mirrors the same stories being told on the opposite side of the globe? Boggles the mind.....they didn't have large ocean vessels back then, they didn't have planes or phones or internet; there couldn't have been any possible way for these two cultures to come up with similar stories during the same general time period. (Every culture for example as some kind of Creation Myth, Adam and Eve Story, and a Great Flood/Deluge story.).....definitely made me reconsider some of my views haha.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
You might want to be careful with listening to voices that nobody else hears. Modern medicine has diagnosed that as schizophrenia and it is manageable with appropriate medications.
Lol, first, I said voice, not voices lol. ...It's just one voice; not plural. XD

Second: It's not an ACTUAL literal voice lmao. XD It's just my conscience/higher self trying to guide me to making a better life choice as opposed to throwing it all away on a fools errand of vengeance. Everybody's got one.......A conscience, I mean; not a fool's errand of vengeance lmao. XD




Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
Which parts do you enjoy the most? About bashing baby heads into stones? Ripping pregnant women's bellies open? Eternal torture of everyone who did not accept Jesus as their Savior?
I can't recall those parts specifically; they're definitely not my favorite stories; awfully strange that you would think that lol. XD

I guess I enjoy the comedic parts the most, and the stories of heroes, ESPECIALLY the stories about heroes that are kinda funny lol. Like David and Goliath; what a moment that was when he was a small boy and slew the Giant with nothing more than a piece of cloth and a rock hahaha. But what does our hero do when he grows up to become King? He falls in love with his best friends' lady friend, sends his buddy off to die in a war, JUST so that he could claim her as his own. Lmao....the Sunday School teachers must've left that part out when I was a little kid. XD Oh, or Samson and Delilah (dude with long hair and super strength, whose kryptonite was cutting his hair). Funny story. Delilah tried to get him to spill the secret of his strength to her, and each time, Samson would tell her....a LIE lmao; like it was just a game to him, until he finally decided to take pity on her or whatever and finally tell her the truth, only to get stabbed in the back and have a building dropped on him. Laughed. My. Ass. Off. XD


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
I'll have to agree with you here.
Indeed, never leave home without it.

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Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
Yep. By elite men for elite men. Definitely not by women. And not by slaves. And not by oppressed ethnicities.
Actually, I might've been a bit presumptuous in using the word "men"; I should have just used the word "people", because for all I know, the elite back then perhaps thought themselves far too important to do the writing themselves and would rather have their slaves do it, (maybe not though; perhaps education was only bequeathed to the elite classes of society). Oh, and there is a Book of Ruth after all; I'm not sure if she was the one that wrote it though. Given the times though, it's probably a fairly safe assumption that all the books of the Bible were written by males; people were a lot more sexist back then; it could've been that women were seen as only being good for housewife duties and procreation.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
I understand you logic. Nonetheless, on what criteria would you chose which parts of the Bible are true and which are false? I mean, by that logic, 90% or even 100% of the Bible could be false.
I can only look within and listen to my gut; ask God personally if this is His will; if the feeling is positive then it probably is; if the feeling is negative then it probably comes from Satan, or one of his innumerable minions, perhaps working in a House of the Lord thousands of years ago as a "scribe" lol. ....I have to trust God to speak to me personally or educate me in some other manner, according to His true will.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
Just like the USA - no way a Jew, an atheist, or a Muslim could be elected president.

No. Effing. Way.
I don't believe that; there was a time not too long ago that nobody ever thought there could possibly be a BLACK President either. Times change. In this country we have the freedom of religion, and the People in America don't often elect a President based on their religion; they elect them based on the Politics; whether or not this person will be good for THEM; very few give three shades of crap about which deity the President prefers to worship. (Although in this current environment of global terror, I have to agree that a Muslim presidential candidate in America would definitely be hard-pressed and have to have a reeealllly good platform to run on....hell, maybe not even then. What can I say? Maybe if so many of them weren't trying to kill us all the time, I'd be more open to it and not suspicious. XD But a Jew? I don't care if they're Jewish or not. JESUS was a Jew lmao. And atheists? No prob there; I'd vote for an atheist. I can totally understand atheism; I might even prefer an atheist President lmao; atheists can be more trusted to not get as many crazy whacko ideas of world domination in their heads. XD




Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
What were you saying, about that being "in the past"?
Haha, fair point, fair point, but still; humanity has made a lot of progress. Shit like that still happens in some places occasionally, but by and large, I like to think most people are good people, even if just deep down haha.

--John
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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 11:39 AM

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Originally Posted by Mary Etheldreda View Post
Well that's nice. What are you doing to find a young bride? Landover Baptist Church has a very helpful guide, found HERE. You can join the conversation or ask questions HERE.

I'm not doing anything to find a young bride. I suck at romance, and I'm not interested in starting a family; there's a good chance I'm gonna fall into a fiery basement or get blown up or something; maybe a helicopter crash; that'd be fun. But not if I was leaving a family behind sans a father and husband. I'm scared of intimate touch, and I'm scared of being a father; worried I'd just mess them up somehow. Rather not risk it. Plus, I think there's way too many people on the planet as it is lmao; more people oughta just be keeping it in their pants if ya ask me. XD
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Bible Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 11:43 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Hamilton View Post
Also, if I recall correctly, there's a place in the Bible that says Hell is specifically reserved for the Devil and his Fallen Angels; both of which are non-human entities; that Hell was never intended for the punishment of God's Children?

I could very well be mistaken. ...But didn't Jesus dying on the Cross save us ALL in that moment; He died for our sins, right? So that we'd never have to face the fires of Hell for our sins, because everyone of us will fall short of being absolutely perfect and without sin?
Please, Mr. Hamilton, do not trust your memory, as you have in this age of the Interwebs an easy access to the actual Bible!



Hell is intended for the punishment of those who do not accept Jesus!

Matthew 13:41-43
The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

Luke tells us about one person, a rich man (not a devil nor an angel), who is in Hell in this very moment as I write this.

Luke 16:22-23
And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.

Jesus died to Save those who believe in Him and do the Will of His Father (Matthew 7:21), who is God who is also Jesus (John 10:30).

John 13:18
He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.

Once we accept Jesus we become pure (but only if we accept Him and do His Will) and sin-free and cannot sin! It is such joy to be among those.

1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.

It was a pleasure to educate you!


Yours in Christ,

Elmer


2 Kings 18:25 - Am I now come up without the LORD against this place to destroy it? The LORD said to me, Go up against this land, and destroy it.



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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 02:33 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elmer G. White View Post
Please, Mr. Hamilton, do not trust your memory, as you have in this age of the Interwebs an easy access to the actual Bible!

Please...Mr. Hamilton is my father; you can call me John.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elmer G. White View Post
Hell is intended for the punishment of those who do not accept Jesus!

Matthew 13:41-43
The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth. Then shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father. Who hath ears to hear, let him hear.

Thanks for sharing! Two things I'd like to point out in those verses. The first is that it says that God's angels will remove all things that offend....from His kingdom. ...His kingdom, as in Heaven? Not an Earth kingdom? ...Interesting choice of words.

Second thing...it says they will be cast into a furnace of fire....it doesn't actually say HELL. And who's to say whether or not it's a LITERAL furnace of fire? It could very well be a metaphor for something else; it's possible the Prophet simply couldn't find any words from his native language in which to best actually describe his visions, so he just described it as a furnace.

Lastly, it goes on to say "THEN shall the righteous shine forth as the sun in the kingdom of their Father." ...He who hath ears to hear, let him hear.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Elmer G. White View Post
Luke tells us about one person, a rich man (not a devil nor an angel), who is in Hell in this very moment as I write this.

Luke 16:22-23
And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom.
Huh; doesn't say that he's there at this very moment. This was written over 2000 years ago; perhaps the rich man sincerely repented for his sins at last and God showed him mercy. Like a father, spanking their toddler for running too close to the wood stove, lest the reckless act go unpunished and the tot one day falls into the stove and dies. The spanking/punishment/torment is only used by a loving father in order to protect their child. Every good father wants their children to be redeemed. Spare the rod; spoil the child, as the old Biblical adage goes.




Quote:
Originally Posted by Elmer G. White View Post
Jesus died to Save those who believe in Him and do the Will of His Father (Matthew 7:21), who is God who is also Jesus (John 10:30).
I was taught as a child that it was through Grace that I am saved, not through works. Those who have Faith in Jesus will most assuredly see Him in Heaven; how could one meet him otherwise? It's impossible to meet someone that you have convinced yourself doesn't exist.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elmer G. White View Post
John 13:18
He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
Huh, this doesn't say anything about Hell per se; just condemnation. I agree completely.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elmer G. White View Post
Once we accept Jesus we become pure (but only if we accept Him and do His Will) and sin-free and cannot sin! It is such joy to be among those.
I agree; if one accepts Jesus as the Son of God, one cannot help but WANT to do His will (to the best of their ability of course). But completely sin-free? ...I dunno about that; for it is written that if one even becomes angry with their brother, they have committed sin; murdering them in their hearts. In this world, there will always be instances where we become furious with our brothers and sisters; our neighbors. We may in the heat of the moment say things that we regret later on. There are always and constantly doors opening up the way for sin to come in, and we're not always strong enough to notice it every single time....that's how Evil works; I know that much from firsthand experience. It's sneaky. It slithers in like a silent snake, beautiful on the surface, yet deadly on the inside. We humans are like children in a sense; naive and trusting, prone to making mistakes. What's really important is that we are able to recognize it when it happens, and repent, begging our Father in Heaven for forgiveness. To feel genuine remorse for causing harm to ourselves or others; even un-intentional harm.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elmer G. White View Post
1 John 3:9
Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
Again; I think it's nearly impossible to become 100% sin-proof; to do so might require an entire lifetime before you've finally found the right path to take in order to nip sin in the butt before it has a chance to sneak up on you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elmer G. White View Post
It was a pleasure to educate you!


Yours in Christ,

Elmer
Thanks for taking the time to educate me! You've given me a lot to think about.


--John
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Rebuke Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 03:30 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Hamilton View Post

Second thing...it says they will be cast into a furnace of fire....it doesn't actually say HELL. And who's to say whether or not it's a LITERAL furnace of fire? It could very well be a metaphor for something else; it's possible the Prophet simply couldn't find any words from his native language in which to best actually describe his visions, so he just described it as a furnace.

Huh; doesn't say that he's there at this very moment. This was written over 2000 years ago; perhaps the rich man sincerely repented for his sins at last and God showed him mercy. Like a father, spanking their toddler for running too close to the wood stove, lest the reckless act go unpunished and the tot one day falls into the stove and dies. The spanking/punishment/torment is only used by a loving father in order to protect their child. Every good father wants their children to be redeemed. Spare the rod; spoil the child, as the old Biblical adage goes.
I see, you're negotiating with God, Mr. Hamilton (I do prefer to keep our relationship formal at the moment). You're trying semantics. Very well, does it really matter if you're going to spend Eternity in a hot place filled with noxious gases and torment because of the burning that is called "hell" or in a hot place filled with noxious gases and torment because of the burning that is called "a furnace"? The end result is the same, torture that is going to last forever.

Revelation 14:10-11
The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb: And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.

As you can see, the Rich Man is still there. No pardon. Forever. You're spending a lot of time trying to make a deal with Jesus (but, trust me, there's a much better dealmaker guiding the Nation at the moment) when you could just read the Bible and find out these things yourself. Don't get me wrong. It is always a privilege to guide the ignorant into the Light that is the True Word of Jesus (John 1:4).


Yours in Christ,

Elmer


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Jesus Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 04:19 PM

Brother John,


First of all, my, how refreshing it is to see another interlectual on these friendly forums. You see, I am a young, intelligent, well-built equine gnathologist (you can sense already that I am quite above the norm in this site). I am very near the end of my accelerated PhD program in the field of creation science. I note you have been engaging in intercourse here with one of my professors: the esteemed Dr. Elmer White. What an exciting experience it must be for you to have the counsel of such an erudite, articulate, and well known person. I recall the first time I sat under him. I felt his exceptionally large presence and felt as if my capacity had been made somehow more capacitous (by his knowledge).


But let's talk about YOU, sir. Your quest to live for the LORD GOD in all His richness and fullness is honorable. You see, our GOD doesn't like it when we give attention to other things. (Exodus 34:14) We must desire Him in His Entirety. It's kind of like when you go to Mass with your Catholic mother and she doesn't want you to see that Mrs. Evans has a prettier hat, or that Miss Louise has become quite the eligible bachelorette, or any other woman there could ever be as wonderful as your own mother and she guilts you the entire afternoon for saying how pretty the lady who did the Bible reading was or how well she spoke. But that's all behind us now so let's move on, since I have.


But then you remember how stifling it was to not be able to have your own opinion, I mean - Miss Louise was, indeed, hot, and while she wasn't my cup of tea she might have been a whole pitcher of tea for a man into those kinds of things. But thankfully the deacon had a special love for youth and he embraced us every Sunday morning just like he was our daddy so it took away the hurt from mother's rejection and I only walked funny for a few minutes. But that was back then, and here you are today, now, in the present.


Not back when passive aggressive behavior coming from your mom made everything taste icky and you stabbed your teddy bear late one night and - but, well, I digress.


The love of Jesus is a transforming thing; it changes us and makes us different. I praise His Name for these things and the more you get to know Him the more you'll also praise Him. I am going to my prayer closet for a few hours.


BrotherLarry


Proverbs 21:31 KJV 1611:
“The horse is prepared against the day of battell: but safetie is of the Lord.”

Lord, may I serve my equine brothers and sisters just as I do my fellow man.
Amen and Amen
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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-05-2017, 04:42 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Hamilton View Post
I'm not doing anything to find a young bride. I suck at romance, and I'm not interested in starting a family; there's a good chance I'm gonna fall into a fiery basement or get blown up or something; maybe a helicopter crash; that'd be fun. But not if I was leaving a family behind sans a father and husband. I'm scared of intimate touch, and I'm scared of being a father; worried I'd just mess them up somehow. Rather not risk it. Plus, I think there's way too many people on the planet as it is lmao; more people oughta just be keeping it in their pants if ya ask me. XD
Well there's your problem, dear. Jesus tells us that He doesn't care about your thoughts, intentions, or even emotions. He cares about your obedience (Ecclesiastes 12:13; Matthew 21:28-32). Mankind was created to be Children of God and subdue and dominate every life on earth (Genesis 1:28), and that doesn't happen when men stay home playing Onan with his right hand (Genesis 38:9-10). You talk about risk and yet you ignore the greatest risk of all - the risk to your eternal well-being (Matthew 13:41-42).


Hello, my name is Mary. I hope to fellowship with you! That is, unless you don't listen to church authority (Deuteronomy 17:12); are a witch (Exodus 22:17); are a homosexual (Leviticus 20:13; Romans 1:24-32); or fortuneteller (Leviticus 20:27) or a snotty kid who hits their dad (Exodus 21:15); or curses their parents (Proverbs 20:20; Leviticus 20:9); an adulterer (Leviticus 20:10); a non-Christian (Exodus 22:19; Deuteronomy 13:7-12; Deuteronomy 17:2-5;Romans 1:24-32); an atheist (2 Chronicles 15:12-13); or false prophet (Zechariah 13:3); from the town of one who worships another, false god (Deuteronomy 13:13-19); were a non-virgin bride (Deuteronomy 22:20-21); or blasphemer (Leviticus 24:10-16), as God calls for your execution and will no doubt send you to Hell, and I have no interest developing a friendship with the Spiritually Walking Dead.

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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-06-2017, 02:25 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Hamilton View Post
I don't believe that, personally....I used to though. I used to hate God with a passion; so angry at Him for not saving me from those monsters. I still remember praying to Him night after night year after year for Him to do something, anything to save me...but no one ever came. ...That's what originally made me lose faith; I even thought for a while that I was simply coming to terms with reality by telling myself there's no God. But over the years, I started getting angry at God; blaming Him for not doing anything, accusing Him of doing it to me on purpose even. The anger then turned to hatred...then I had an epiphany of sorts one day: ...How could I genuinely hate and blame something that I don't believe exists? That's when I realized that God never actually left me; I never really stopped believing in Him deep down....It's only been the past two couple days or so though that I've finally been able to admit that.
So if you decided to believe in God, do you hate Him again for being so cruel towards you?

Quote:
......God gave humanity free will according to the Bible. What they decide to do with their freedom of choice....isn't God's fault.

So basically what you are saying, is that it is worthless to pray to God because He is not going to change the hearts of oppressive people and all the hatred, violence, and oppression will continue, because the free will of the oppressors is more important than the suffering of the oppressed?


Isn't this sort of God kinda... useless?


Quote:
That's kind of hard for me to say, but it's true to me now....feels weird to say. I don't know why God didn't save me....but I do believe God can work incredible good out of tragedies,

So what was the incredible good that came out of Nazi concentration camps?


Quote:
but that doesn't necessarily mean that He orchestrated the tragedies to begin with.....

Allowing them to happen makes Him an accomplice according to the laws.


Quote:
If I'm to believe in God, I guess I'll have to believe in the Devil as well....The Prince of Darkness/Prince of Lies, the Deceiver, The Evil One...Satan. ...Maybe he's behind all the sin and tragedy in the world...NOT my father in Heaven?

Remember that God created the devil. And as an all-knowing deity He would have known what that would do to the world. So again - yes, God wants the devil to create suffering.

Quote:
I could very well be mistaken. ...But didn't Jesus dying on the Cross save us ALL in that moment; He died for our sins, right?

Only for those who believe in Him. Everybody else goes to Hell, no matter how good people they are.

Quote:
You might want to read a copy of "Killing Jesus" by Bill O'Reilly. It's basically a down-to-earth historical account of the life and death of Jesus; what the government of the area was like, Herod's slaughtering of the firstborn in an attempt to kill the one that was to become the Christ, etc. There's at least enough circumstantial historical evidence to conclude that there really was a dude named Jesus who was possibly quite the rabble rouser to say the least. XD (The Romans by the way were excellent record-keepers.)

Please give me the actual original source, not a secondary one. As far as I know Mr. O'Reilly is not a specialists in Classical studies/ancient history.

Quote:
Dang; where in the Bible does it say God killed babies whenever He wanted???

Have you ever heard of the Flood?


Quote:
I know that it is written God is jealous, but where does it say he is cruel and merciless?

Killing babies, and allowing all of the abuses in the name of Christianity over the last 2000 years.

Quote:
is was the Free Choice of humanity to engage in war, perhaps because Satan set everything in motion, too.

God set Satan in motion.


Quote:
I think I do recall a verse where God admits to creating evil, but I definitely don't recall any verses where He says that he ENJOYS making people suffer; I'd like a quote from the Bible on that if anyone can provide it.

He made Job suffer for a simple bet, didn't He? Isn't that making people suffer just for fun?

Quote:
Indirectly, yes; He created Adam and Eve, and everything just kind of went downhill from there; I'm sure you know the story.

Yes. The Serpent was the most perfect of all God's creations, according to Genesis.

Quote:
Oh I did. They looked into it. The people who kidnapped me lawyered up; real fancy one. Apparently they were millionaires. They got off on a technicality. They still roam free. ......So much for the police. There's nothing I can do.....nothing legal anyway. I'm just a small town farm boy; well below and under the poverty line. Sadly these days there isn't actually "Justice for all" in a court of law; only for those who can pay the right price.....another thing that makes me feel so angry it makes me sick.

That is disheartening indeed. I'm not a fan of shaming people on the internet, but they would be good candidates for that. Instead of doing something violent and stupid.

Quote:
Indeed; it's truly eerie how similar so many different stories from so many different cultures are; how really all of these stories are actually re-tellings of the same story.

That's what happens when plagiarism occurs. And the similarities to the (much older) Sumerian and Babylonian texts are not surprising since that was the cultural milieu where the Israelite culture originated. I mean, theyeven copied the story of Moses birth and being sent down the river in a basket from Sargon the Great! Couldn't the writers of the Old Testament come up with something a bit more original?! Why reheat such an old story?!

Quote:
how on earth could primitive cultures in South America, (never-mind the Sumerians and Mesopotanians mythologies lol), POSSIBLY make up a story that almost exactly mirrors the same stories being told on the opposite side of the globe?

"Primitive cultures in South America" (whatever you intended to mean by it) did not come up with anything even close to the Biblical stories.


Unless you are thinking that the Christian God has something in common with Mother Earth and Father Sun.


So here's that.


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(Every culture for example as some kind of Creation Myth,

Sure. Everybody wanted to know, where did we come from. The point is, that each story is dramatically different from each other.


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Adam and Eve Story,

????


I'm not following.


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and a Great Flood/Deluge story.)

...Or a story of destruction of human kind by some other means. Because many different tragic events would be passed from one generation to another and get bigger and bigger every time it was re-told.


Quote:
Actually, I might've been a bit presumptuous in using the word "men"; I should have just used the word "people", because for all I know, the elite back then perhaps thought themselves far too important to do the writing themselves and would rather have their slaves do it, (maybe not though; perhaps education was only bequeathed to the elite classes of society).

You answered yourself, there, in bold.


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it could've been that women were seen as only being good for housewife duties and procreation.

That is what the Bible says.

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I can only look within and listen to my gut; ask God personally if this is His will; if the feeling is positive then it probably is; if the feeling is negative then it probably comes from Satan, or one of his innumerable minions, perhaps working in a House of the Lord thousands of years ago as a "scribe" lol. ....I have to trust God to speak to me personally or educate me in some other manner, according to His true will.

So for you, both God and Satan are like little imaginary friends, then?

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In this country we have the freedom of religion, and the People in America don't often elect a President based on their religion; they elect them based on the Politics; whether or not this person will be good for THEM; very few give three shades of crap about which deity the President prefers to worship. (Although in this current environment of global terror, I have to agree that a Muslim presidential candidate in America would definitely be hard-pressed and have to have a reeealllly good platform to run on....hell, maybe not even then. What can I say? Maybe if so many of them weren't trying to kill us all the time, I'd be more open to it and not suspicious.

Thank you for contradicting yourself and giving me an argument supporting my thesis. That it is about religion.


Quote:
Haha, fair point, fair point, but still; humanity has made a lot of progress.

There is about the same or more human suffering now than in the past. I don't see much progress, there. We are making technological progress; but socially, we are as retarded as ever. Or even more than ever.


John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-06-2017, 03:20 AM

I'm all for civil discussion, but I don't think you're interested in that; you just want to be a mean bully and fight and argue for the fun of it like a baby. In my personal opinion.

Let me know when you grow up.
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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-06-2017, 03:51 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Hamilton View Post
I'm all for civil discussion, but I don't think you're interested in that; you just want to be a mean bully and fight and argue for the fun of it like a baby. In my personal opinion.

Let me know when you grow up.
My goodness! You seem to be all for civil discussion when you want to rant against The Bible and waste God's precious server storage space. But if anyone questions your twaddle and hatred of God, WE ARE BULLIES?


Get Christ before it is too late!


In Him


Matthew 19:14 "But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven."

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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-06-2017, 04:02 AM

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Originally Posted by John Hamilton View Post
Hello, my name is John Hamilton..
Yes, we all have trauma in our lives, but I could not bother to read that miserable wall of self-pity. Something about sex, I guess.


Listen, "sexual assault" is almost always the victim's fault. I guess you could say I was "raped" several times, but if I had not taken off my pants and briefs in a gay bar, and wagged my booty at the crowd, it would not have happened.


Grow up, indeed.


In Him Always


Matthew 19:14 "But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven."

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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-06-2017, 04:16 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by John Hamilton View Post
I'm all for civil discussion, but I don't think you're interested in that; you just want to be a mean bully and fight and argue for the fun of it like a baby. In my personal opinion.

Let me know when you grow up.
Hello again Mr. Hamilton. Please show me where I behaved like a mean bully. I am an anthropologist genuinely interested in the logic of your world view. It is a personal interest, your responses will not be used in my research. I do not have an IRB permission for that, and I have my hands full working on the True Christian members of the Landover community anyway.


I'm just trying to understand how a person can be religious or spiritual, while at the same time realizing that there is much more evil than good in the world. If God exists, is He giving cancer to little babies? Or is he just a witness to all of human suffering, unwilling or unable to answer people's prayers for help?


If He is unwilling to help, then He is not worthy of our worship.


If He is unable to help, then worshiping Him is a waste of time.


How do you, who have suffered as a child, reconcile your suffering, and the fact that God did not answer the prayers of your parents to save you, with your belief in a loving and powerful God?


John 14:6 Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.
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Default Re: Lost...and Formerly Alone - 12-06-2017, 07:44 AM

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
Hello again Mr. Hamilton. Please show me where I behaved like a mean bully. I am an anthropologist genuinely interested in the logic of your world view. It is a personal interest, your responses will not be used in my research. I do not have an IRB permission for that, and I have my hands full working on the True Christian members of the Landover community anyway.
It's possible I was confusing you as being in league the people here that are like that guy who just said that it's the victim's fault for being raped; even if the victim was just a little boy. That philosophy infuriates me to no end; it is absolutely VILE and DISGUSTING in every sense of the word. ....I'll go out on a limb here and take it that I made an honest mistake in assuming you were one of those many psychopaths. Hope you really are genuine; you'd only be the second person here that didn't spout hatred like that.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
I'm just trying to understand how a person can be religious or spiritual, while at the same time realizing that there is much more evil than good in the world. If God exists, is He giving cancer to little babies? Or is he just a witness to all of human suffering, unwilling or unable to answer people's prayers for help?
I'll see if I can help you on your journey to understanding, but I can only speak from my own perspective; different people have different modes of faith; what works best for one, may just go right over the head of the next guy.

For me, I'm trying to become more spiritual because the evil of the world gets to me too much, and I become wrathful and full of hatred, and I don't like those feelings; I don't like what those feelings make me do. So I try to be better. It's NOT easy by any means; sometimes, it really seems like there is more evil in this world than there is good....until of course you start looking for the good, and casting the evil out of your mind. There's still goodness in the world. Having good friends and family in your life helps ease the burden a lot too. I'd rather continuously strive to be more spiritual and find inner peace, stumbling over the obstacles in my way, rather than just give up on trying to be a good person, succumbing completely to the evil of the world, doing whatever the hell I want. Some say that's what separates the humans from the animals.

I don't believe God gives cancers to babies. Cancer and death are just a part of life. I don't think anyone is to truly blame for Cancer in general. Life will always come with tragedies and blessings; God isn't necessarily orchestrating things the way you imply; at least I don't personally believe He is.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
If He is unwilling to help, then He is not worthy of our worship.
Not necessarily. God is willing to help anyone who is sincere in following His lead....but that doesn't mean He's going to interfere with fate to spare you from a tragedy which may very well make you a stronger person in the end.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
If He is unable to help, then worshiping Him is a waste of time.
You seem to imply that worshiping Him is something that people do just to get stuff out of Him; maybe some people don't ask God for ANYTHING at all....yet still worship Him? Think about it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolores de Barriga View Post
How do you, who have suffered as a child, reconcile your suffering, and the fact that God did not answer the prayers of your parents to save you, with your belief in a loving and powerful God?
With a lot of difficulty, that's how lol. It took me a long time to stop being mad at God and blaming Him for what happened in Utah. That was before I truly know in my heart that God is Love; and God is Good; he performs NO evil Himself. I can only assume that the reason God didn't save me (at least when I asked Him to anyway...he did save me way later lol), is because He needed me to experience those years of agony in order to prepare me for a greater purpose; the purpose of making sure that what happened to me doesn't happen to any other child. WITHOUT all that suffering, I'd never have acquired the will power necessary to see it through to the end; to literally do everything I can to end their reign of terror, even if I have to spend the rest of my life behind bars, it would all be worth it if it meant preventing those unspeakable tragedies from ever happening again; I don't even care if I have to die for it, just so long as it's finally done........Maybe.....just maybe, I am God's Wrath.

....Natural justice....but none of it would have ever been possible if God had decided to interfere with Fate and redirect the course of Destiny. I'm sure it pained Him greatly to see me suffer, crying out for Him. I'm sure he WANTED to with every fiber of His being....but alas, He couldn't...because then there'd be countless others after me, and I wouldn't have been turned into such a perfect weapon for God to use against them....


--John
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