[barton]

Originally Posted by Witch of Endor

Hello again, Christians. I have another question, if you might indulge me.

To be honest, it doesn't matter to me how God chose to save people prior to 1611.

This is the major mistake that you people make. You seem to think it's our responsibility to explain God and all His wondrous deeds to your satisfaction.

Do you study martial arts? I did, prior to my conversion. I studied Hapkido for many years with a group of Korean nationals. Let me tell you, they may be yellow, they may have slanty eyes and they may reek of Kimchi but they're mean little buggers. All that jumping around and kicking is not easy.

Well, one day Jung Sung-Wu (our instructor) decided to demonstrate his skill and was sparing with some wannabe half-Jap kid with a 1st degree black belt in Karate. Before anyone knew what happened, the jap was on the floor moaning. But what did this mean? Hapkido is better than Karate? That's what those little guys all though. I kinda just thought maybe they sell black belts in Karate very cheaply.

It's the same with you. You prowl around picking fights with Christians and, I bet, once you find one you can trip up with your pre-Christian era Greco logic, you'll finally pronounce victory. Congratulations when that happens for you. Don't blame us when you wake up in Hell one day.

[MitzaLizalor]

I had always thought that any similarities between God's Word ©1611 and heathen literature were straight out plagiarism. The fact that they might superficially appear to pre-date New Testament events is just evidence of their demon authors scrying into the future (our past, at this stage in history, of course) - albeit with limited success since they get most of the details wrong!

Additionally, a vision of Heaven could be Heaven in the future, couldn't it? Revelation contains accurate details of future history, and God could vouchsafe any period, past, present or future in a vision?

I am not offering that as an opinion, just a query really, and will stand for correction from the Pastors at any time, naturally.

[Little Donkey]

According to my pastor, everyone who passed before 1988 went straight to hell. The One True Path is clearly shown in the graphic below. False idol worshippers who are not members of the National Missionary Baptist Convention of America are condemned to the eternal fire. Their choice and I guess they chose to burn.

[Cavaleiro de Cristo]

According to Dante Alighieri's "La Divina Commedia", where he describes the Inferno (which is hell), he states that all those who were virtuous and good humans in common but had not the chance to convert to Christianity in common, were sent to a very mild part of hell. They would not get tortured by demons, yet still live in the darkness because they were just unfortunate not to be able to become Christian.
Some of those virtuous people Dante mentioned, are Aristoteles, Saladin, Cicero, Ovidius, Socrates, Plato, etc....

So basically everyone who was not able to become Christian (people born before Christ or whose circumstances didn't allow them to become Christian) would go to the exterior circle of hell, where they would not get tortured, as long as they were virtuous

[Mrs. Mary Whitford]

Originally Posted by Cavaleiro de Cristo

According to Dante Alighieri's "La Divina Commedia", where he describes the Inferno (which is hell), he states that all those who were virtuous and good humans in common but had not the chance to convert to Christianity in common, were sent to a very mild part of hell. They would not get tortured by demons, yet still live in the darkness because they were just unfortunate not to be able to become Christian.
Some of those virtuous people Dante mentioned, are Aristoteles, Saladin, Cicero, Ovidius, Socrates, Plato, etc....

So basically everyone who was not able to become Christian (people born before Christ or whose circumstances didn't allow them to become Christian) would go to the exterior circle of hell, where they would not get tortured, as long as they were virtuous

According to a story by Dante. Yes, who needs the Bible when we have Dante?

[Cavaleiro de Cristo]

Originally Posted by Sister Mary Maria

According to a story by Dante. Yes, who needs the Bible when we have Dante?

Documentary about hell is very incomplete in the bible. When Dante finished his La Divina Commedia ((A very nice crossover between medieval ideals and renaissance ideals, by the way)), it became the most widespread and most accepted idea of hell, heaven and purgatory. Mostly because information about it was very vague in the bible. (Nothing wrong with the bible, though)

[Alphonse Alban]

Originally Posted by Cavaleiro de Cristo

(Nothing wrong with the bible, though)

Oh, a Mary worshipper approves the Bible. Hallelujah!

[Cavaleiro de Cristo]

Originally Posted by Alphonse Alban

Oh, a Mary worshipper approves the Bible. Hallelujah!

So according to you, Catholic people are 'magically' not able to approve the holy Bible? That is actually very blasphemous you tell me there...

[Didymus Much]

Originally Posted by Alphonse Alban

Oh, a Mary worshipper approves the Bible. Hallelujah!

Doesn't specify which Bible (of course), and needs to cite non-Biblical sources (Dante) to support their "point". Typical Catholic. On the plus side, he hasn't told us to read the Bible in "the original Latin" (that always cracks me up).

Seriously, CdC, even Rome has refudiated purgatory as a heretical money-making scheme. Dante is fiction, with scant Biblical support.

Try reading the Bible to see what it really says. Maybe then you'll see how little resemblance there is between it's contents and Roman Catholicism.

[Cavaleiro de Cristo]

Originally Posted by Didymus Much

Doesn't specify which Bible (of course), and needs to cite non-Biblical sources (Dante) to support their "point". Typical Catholic. On the plus side, he hasn't told us to read the Bible in "the original Latin" (that always cracks me up).

Seriously, CdC, even Rome has refudiated purgatory as a heretical money-making scheme. Dante is fiction, with scant Biblical support.

Try reading the Bible to see what it really says. Maybe then you'll see how little resemblance there is between it's contents and Roman Catholicism.

No, it is now accepted in Catholicism that there is a Purgatory. Yes, there are some wacko people in the Vatican, but that is the same story in EVERY top of EVERY religion. Same counts for Baptism as it does for Catholicism really.

[Didymus Much]

Originally Posted by Cavaleiro de Cristo

No, it is now accepted in Catholicism that there is a Purgatory.

So they've changed their story yet again? It's hard to keep up with the "Eternal Church" these days. Btw, there's still NO BIBLICAL SUPPORT for purgatory.

Yes, there are some wacko people in the Vatican, but that is the same story in EVERY top of EVERY religion. Same counts for Baptism as it does for Catholicism really.

Errr, there is no "top" of this religion. Every congregation is independent. The exact distribution of "wackos" here is a topic for a different thread, tho.

[Cavaleiro de Cristo]

Allright, let's look from a different point of view.

Roughly the first sub-group of Christianity is the Orthodox Church (very roughly) In the beginning days it wasn't as we know it today (beautiful iconic art). Slowly but surely it spread around Europe, being forced to take over some pagan features. (Christmas is a very good example of paganisms taken over by Christianity)
When Christianity has settled itself in a strong position in the cradle of Western civilization (Europe), it split up in 1054AD iirc. The Eastern (Orthodox) Church with the Patriarchy in Constantinople versus the Western (Roman Catholic) Church with the Holy See in Rome. Those two groups steadily grow away from each other. Catholicism kicks some butt in South/Latin America as Spanish and Portuguese explorers scout the New World, and Catholicism settles there too.
Now, disaster strikes as an upstart monk rebels against the two main representatives of Catholicism in that era: His holiness the Pope and the Emperor of Germany. Protestantism goes wild and snatches about all of North-West Europe from the Pope's hands. The Anglicans in England split up some more until we finally get the Baptists. Baptists didn't get any noteworthy success in Europe, but grew alot in the English Colonies until where we are now.

Roughly put, Baptism is a branch of Protestantism which on it's own is a branch of Catholicism with is a branch of Christianity itself.

Very rough sketch, but it basically puts everything in place.

[MitzaLizalor]

Originally Posted by Cavaleiro de Cristo

Allright, let's look from a different point of view.

Roughly the first sub-group of Christianity is the Orthodox Church (very roughly) In the beginning days it wasn't as we know it today (beautiful iconic art). Slowly but surely it spread around Europe, being forced to take over some pagan features. (Christmas is a very good example of paganisms taken over by Christianity)
When Christianity has settled itself in a strong position in the cradle of Western civilization (Europe), it split up in 1054AD iirc. The Eastern (Orthodox) Church with the Patriarchy in Constantinople versus the Western (Roman Catholic) Church with the Holy See in Rome. Those two groups steadily grow away from each other. Catholicism kicks some butt in South/Latin America as Spanish and Portuguese explorers scout the New World, and Catholicism settles there too.
Now, disaster strikes as an upstart monk rebels against the two main representatives of Catholicism in that era: His holiness the Pope and the Emperor of Germany. Protestantism goes wild and snatches about all of North-West Europe from the Pope's hands. The Anglicans in England split up some more until we finally get the Baptists. Baptists didn't get any noteworthy success in Europe, but grew alot in the English Colonies until where we are now.

Roughly put, Baptism is a branch of Protestantism which on it's own is a branch of Catholicism with is a branch of Christianity itself.

Very rough sketch, but it basically puts everything in place.

Is that what some priest taught you? He was also lying when he called you "special" - but since you seem to like endorsements from pagans, here's one that might interest you:

(on the occasion of Herod's birthday his new wife gave him a "nice birthday present" in the form of a whorish display from her daughter, and Herod was so appreciative that he invited the little tart to chose a gift for herself)
And she went forth, and said unto her mother, What shall I ask? And she said, The head of John the Baptist.

So it seems that Baptists have been around a bit longer than you said! Herodias would feel quite at home in your putrid vatican. It has nothing to do with Christianity - and your single lie about Baptists is quite sufficient a reason to disregard everything else you say.

[Pastor Ezekiel]

Originally Posted by Cavaleiro de Cristo

Allright, let's look from a different point of view.... blahblahblah...

Listen up demon, Baptists were the original Christians. Read about it HERE.

Go spew your hatefulness somewhere else.

[Rev. M. Rodimer]

Originally Posted by Cavaleiro de Cristo

Documentary about hell is very incomplete in the bible. When Dante finished his La Divina Commedia ((A very nice crossover between medieval ideals and renaissance ideals, by the way)), it became the most widespread and most accepted idea of hell, heaven and purgatory. Mostly because information about it was very vague in the bible. (Nothing wrong with the bible, though)

Revelation describes Hell most adequately. It is God's Lake of Fire, in which He burns the resurrected damned alive for all eternity.

Dante's levels of hell, purgatory, etc. were invented out of whole cloth. They have nothing to do with the Bible.

Originally Posted by Cavaleiro de Cristo

No, it is now accepted in Catholicism that there is a Purgatory. Yes, there are some wacko people in the Vatican, but that is the same story in EVERY top of EVERY religion. Same counts for Baptism as it does for Catholicism really.

Um, the Vatican decides what Catholicism is.

Or do you say that the most important tenet of Catholicism -- that the Pope is God's Infallible Representative on Earth -- is false, and that the laypeople can decide what doctrine is instead of the Pope?

You're not even a competent Catholic, much less a Christian!

[Cavaleiro de Cristo]

Originally Posted by MitzaLizalor

Is that what some priest taught you? He was also lying when he called you "special" - but since you seem to like endorsements from pagans, here's one that might interest you:

(on the occasion of Herod's birthday his new wife gave him a "nice birthday present" in the form of a whorish display from her daughter, and Herod was so appreciative that he invited the little tart to chose a gift for herself)
And she went forth, and said unto her mother, What shall I ask? And she said, The head of John the Baptist.

So it seems that Baptists have been around a bit longer than you said! Herodias would feel quite at home in your putrid vatican. It has nothing to do with Christianity - and your single lie about Baptists is quite sufficient a reason to disregard everything else you say.

That guys beheading doesn't mean anything. There are no accounts of the Baptist religion roughly before the 1600's

[Lola Handcock]

Originally Posted by Cavaleiro de Cristo

That guys beheading doesn't mean anything. There are no accounts of the Baptist religion roughly before the 1600's

John the Baptist, Baptized Jesus and Jesus was born 2011 years ago. Math is hard huh.

[Cavaleiro de Cristo]

Baptist religon itself didn't occur until around the 1600s.

History is hard, huh.

[Cursed]

Originally Posted by Cavaleiro de Cristo

Baptist religon itself didn't occur until around the 1600s.

History is hard, huh.

The Baptist religion itself started when John the Baptist started being called John the Baptist.

That's why his name is "The Baptist."

Learning is fun, huh?

[Cavaleiro de Cristo]

You're wrong about that, go study some history, lad.


It was a branch of Anglicanism, that is just basic knowledge. Do you have some inferiority complex? Because other religons have done much greater things in the past than Baptism has? Because Baptism couldn't take pride of repelling the Muslims from Iberia, or the construction of huge and majestic cathedrals? Or because your history is boring compared to the awesome and turbulent histories of other religions?
Don't be sad about it, I'm sure history books in the far future will mention baptism in some unimportant phrase.